General Discussion

So I got into a discussion with my boss about who was the worst president ever.  We automatically discounted Recent Presidents since it is too early to say.  Obviously right now Bush is a pretty bad president overall, but if somehow Iraq ends up being a beacon of shining democracy and antiterrorism in the Middle East 50 years from now, President Bush would actually be looked on as one of the best Presidents.  (Not saying that is going to happen but explaining why we didn't include recent presidents)

My boss's answer really surprised me.  Obviously my answer is fairly unorthodox since I am a libertarian and lean towards old school conservative teachings. 

For those that do not know I am in the US Navy and work as a Religious Program Specialist.  Which means my boss is a Chaplain.  He is an ordained minister in the Presbyterian Church of America.  He wasn't always a Minister though and has a degree in History with a Masters in South American History and focused primarily on Brazil (His thesis dealth with something about the Brazilian Airplanes in WW2) he lived in Brazil for many years when he was growing up. 

So when I asked him who he felt with the worst President in history his answer really surprised me.  He said Lincoln.  Which is a huge surprise because of course most lists have him as the best President in history. 

His reasonings were pretty straight forward though.  He said that Lincoln did what ever it took to win the Civil War and that was wrong.  He also prolonged the Civil War by about 3 years by choosing incompetent Generals and when he finally chose Grant, he only chose him because Grant was willing to do what ever it took to win.  He cited Lincoln's suspension of Habeus Corpus and his common practice of seizing land without legal right and without compensation. 

Personally I had never really thought about it that much.  I did know from taking History in College that Lincoln was a bit overated but I never really read that much into these specific points. 

Personally (and I am sure this is no surpise) I to choose a President who is usually favored as one of the best as my choice for the Worst President in History.  I personally choose FDR as the worst President in History.  His New Deal was ultimately a failure that gets undeserved credit for solving the great Depression (which was actually made better by WW2) he also attempted to trample all over the Constitution's check and balances by loading the Supreme Court with Justices that favored his views.  He was very upset because a lot of the "New Deal" was determined to be Unconstitutional by the Supreme Court and instead of changing his ideas to fit the Law, he tried to add justices to the Supreme Court to offset those that defeated his views.  This was a ridiculous attempt at overstepping his powers.  On top of this he also raised tax rates to ridiculously high rates of 91% at the top.  Also, there is some proof that he knew about Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor and they did nothing because he wanted the US to enter WW2 and at the time American Public Sentiment was very much against the war. 

So using our criteria that it is too soon to rate current Presidents (lets say Bush Senior to President is just too soon to call) who do you rate as the worst President in History and Why?  Please don't turn this into a Bush bashing thread.  (I didn't vote for him and I don't like him very much either but I think we have enough posts floating around that bash him) 

If you don't want to make a vote for Worst President in History who do you think is the best and why?

Worse = Andrew Johnson. After the death of Lincoln, Johnson did absolutely nothing. He just sat there and said "Hey look at me! Im the President now!"

2nd worse = Jimmy Carter. His entire administration was a failure. Makes George Bush Jr look like George Washington.

Best = George Washington. First and only President that took office without wanting it. A true politician! lol.  Commanded our Armies to beat back the overwhelmingly powerful British Armada when our forefathers had little to no military training. Washington made the impossible possible. HUZZAH!!!!!!!!!

2nd Best = Abraham Lincoln.  Despite adversity and the fact the lower states wanted to become their own set of nations under a southern government, Lincoln had to do what any person would dread to do. To fight on our own soil to preserve the soverign nation of the United States.  Both sides fought admirably for their cause and after the surrender of General Lee, Lincoln was gentleman enough to forgive him and to strive for peaceful resolutions throughout the aftermath.

Lyndon Johnson.

Originally posted by CleffyII

Lyndon Johnson.

a little known fact about LBJ. He had all of the water lines replaced in all the water fountains in the white house.  Instead of water, Fresca came out. True story

Originally posted by CleffyII

Lyndon Johnson.

Mainly for all that civil rights legislation, right, Cleffy?

I like history threads...

Worst - I do agree with Cabe on FDR, but he was a decent war-time president so he does not get the worst president vote from me. I consider JFK to be the worst. I personally feel he is very over-rated. Most of the civil-rights legislation was done by LBJ not JFK. He also failed to completely back the Bay of Pigs invasion and as a result we all know it failed and spurred on the Cuban Missle Crisis. The Cuban Missle Crisis might not have happened if he had realized he needed to deal with Cuba early on and backed the Bay of Pigs invasion. Instead we came very close to a nuclear war. If he hadn't died so early, he probably wouldn't have such a great reputation.

I don't really have a best or favorite president. A few that I think are notable are George Washington, Abraham Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt.

Most students of history know that George Washington was not only the greatest President of the United States but also one of the world's greatest leaders.  It is not simply because he was the first (or fifth President if you consider the Articles of Confederation).  He was recognized in his own time as best, or "first among men," because of not only his character, command of details, strategic thinking, vision for our great country, but many, many other reasons. 

The worst, on July 3rd, pains me to say this.  It is George Bush.  We know this.  We can feel it.  He exploited the attacks of 9/11, which is something that is very difficult for me (and many millions of Americans) to come to terms with.  He exploited it by using our treasury to fund special interests, send money to states that had nothing to do with 9/11, and invade a country for reasons that had nothing to do with 9/11.  Yes, my fellow Americans, as painful as it is to say, he did take advantage of 9/11 for ... politics.

Bush will be judged as the worst President on every measure

• Public Finance (record debt, "missing," "lost," "unaccounted for" BILLIONS of dollars).*
• Leadership skills (managed, coordination, communication, control, organization, vision)
• Economy (recession, housing implosion, RECORD inflation, oil prices).
• Military (preventing our military from "modernizing";  bad strategic decisions (bad is an understatement);  inadequate care for veterans;  overall bad planning).
• Corruption (turned the DOJ (Department of Justice) into a political organization, which is JUST disgraceful... Attorney General is such an important position for ALL of our Constitutional rights that it has been suggested HUNDREDS of years ago the position should be an elected one;  Bush shows why this position is so important for all the wrong reasons).
• Foreign Relations (so bad needs no explanation unless you do not read the paper or have absolutely no background in International Relations, diplomacy, etc.)

*Pssssssst... do not tell ANYONE I said this:  the government never "loses" BILLIONS of dollars. 

Wow people are actually saying FDR is the worst president? Not only did he lead our country through arguable the worst times we have faced (The Great Depression and WWII). He SAVED our country with the New Deal. Just think if Bush had been president when FDR was. We wouldn't have a country right now.

Originally posted by declaredemer

Most students of history know that George Washington was not only the greatest President of the United States but also one of the world's greatest leaders.  It is not simply because he was the first (or fifth President if you consider the Articles of Confederation).  He was recognized in his own time as best, or "first among men," because of not only his character, command of details, strategic thinking, vision for our great country, but many, many other reasons. 

 

 

The worst, on July 3rd, pains me to say this.  It is George Bush.  We know this.  We can feel it.  He exploited the attacks of 9/11, which is something that is very difficult for me (and many millions of Americans) to come to terms with.  He exploited it by using our treasury to fund special interests, send money to states that had nothing to do with 9/11, and invade a country for reasons that had nothing to do with 9/11.  Yes, my fellow Americans, as painful as it is to say, he did take advantage of 9/11 for ... politics.

 

Bush will be judged as the worst President on every measure

• Public Finance (record debt, "missing," "lost," "unaccounted for" BILLIONS of dollars).*
• Leadership skills (managed, coordination, communication, control, organization, vision)
• Economy (recession, housing implosion, RECORD inflation, oil prices).
• Military (preventing our military from "modernizing";  bad strategic decisions (bad is an understatement);  inadequate care for veterans;  overall bad planning).
• Corruption (turned the DOJ (Department of Justice) into a political organization, which is JUST disgraceful... Attorney General is such an important position for ALL of o