Such is the life of PvP games, of entire hunting grounds being camped by uber large guilds. What about the original PvP / Siege game known as Shadowbane? I remember when that game was in the same situation AoC is as you described it.

How do you compete with a small guild? You don't. Thats the main problem with PvP games, including Dark Age of Camelot. Zerging will always dominate simply because total numbers outweighs player skill.

What can Funcom do to fix this? Well, they way they designed the game, it's basically a hopeless cause to expect anything promising. The main issues with lack of leveling areas won't be fixed entirely by increasing the total number of areas to level in.

People are already screaming that AoC is too instanced. Pretty soon, people are going to want an entire instance to themselves on PvP servers, which kind of defeats the purpose of PvP.

To be completely honest, the only game thats even come close to perfecting a mix of PvE and PvP is of course Dark Age of Camelot. Players could level their toons in the safety of their realms and then venture out into the frontiers to PvP.

Granted I'm on a FFA PvP server in AoC, I heavily agree with your opinion of the current state of the game. However, the problem lies deep in the game mechanics which is that it is a FFA PvP game. Until you separate PvE from PvP, you will have every problem you described.

Even when WoW came out, you were eventually forced to level by quests in enemy territories. WoW was probably less of a hassle, but it was still a zerg wins situation.

There is no true cure for FFA PvP servers and probably never will be thanks to zergs. FFA PvP means the players control every aspect of the gaming environment and you either profit from a large guild or suffer the embarassment of a smaller guild.

Try forming alliances, thats what we've done and it helps to some degree except for the fact you can still hurt other guild members and allies in PvP. I'm kind of doubting the longevity of this game simply because of the FFA PvP. Perhaps the Faction and PvE servers will survive but eventually, AoC FFA PvP servers are going to go the way of Shadowbane and die a slow painful drop in server population.

Originally posted by BizkitNL

I'm going to try PvE, hoping that the content will keep me playing (Though I did get a boring feeling at 24 already, but Ille try to push myself beyond that).

I went from 30 to 40 in the last week couple hrs per day on average just on quests.

how can you lock down an entire area, when the system makes multiple copies of each area? If an instance is camped, just change instance...

OP:
From your post I have learned the following lessons -

1. Don't play on a PVP server.

2. Don't power level a game from release.

Fortunately, I have already learned those lessons and am not repeating them with this game. Funcom has publicly acknowledged many of the problems you stated here and committed to fixing them as soon as possible. You have three options:

1. Pick up another game to play while you wait for the AOC content to catch up.

2. Roll an alt. Or two.

3. Deal with the fact that AoC is a brand new game and push thru.

Originally posted by AmazingAvery

 

Originally posted by BizkitNL

I'm going to try PvE, hoping that the content will keep me playing (Though I did get a boring feeling at 24 already, but Ille try to push myself beyond that).

Dont worry its gets a bit better into the 30's, gearing up for places like Santum of the Burning souls and getting a mount at lvl 40.

 

I went from 30 to 40 in the last week couple hrs per day on average just on quests.

At 40 you THINK you get a mount, then realize that you have 2.5 more gold you need to save up then read on the forums that it takes people to 55 to save up the entire 3g it costs to get a mount.

At the original WoW, my first character was a holy priest (yes, I levelled him all the way as holy). I managed to collect enough money to purchase my first mount at level 56. I don't see much of a difference, or a problem, in this case.

Originally posted by Galadourn

how can you lock down an entire area, when the system makes multiple copies of each area? If an instance is camped, just change instance...

The problem is that the guilds run them. There's only 2-4 instances total for level 70+ people. 4 Guilds run these instances. It's not as difficult as it sounds. You level up a group of 6 at a time, while everyone who has leveled guards the instance. Essentially, it's a vicious cycle, because the big guilds guard the areas, in turn leveling faster. As such, they get more members, which they power-level quicker, while other guilds sluff doing it the slow way. So it's essentially a monopoly of power on late-game experience.

This is only an issue on the FFA PvP server though, as Rhoklaw stated.

Originally posted by Cymdai

 

Originally posted by Galadourn

how can you lock down an entire area, when the system makes multiple copies of each area? If an instance is camped, just change instance...

 

The problem is that the guilds run them. There's only 2-4 instances total for level 70+ people. 4 Guilds run these instances. It's not as difficult as it sounds. You level up a group of 6 at a time, while everyone who has leveled guards the instance. Essentially, it's a vicious cycle, because the big guilds guard the areas, in turn leveling faster. As such, they get more members, which they power-level quicker, while other guilds sluff doing it the slow way. So it's essentially a monopoly of power on late-game experience.

This is only an issue on the FFA PvP server though, as Rhoklaw stated.

So you believe Funcom should do something that interferes with those guild's policies to camp, kill, recruit?

Or do you believe a host of more areas, or instances to existing areas will alleviate the problem?

Sounds like the guilds are being pretty malicious to claim more than one area, and more than one instance as is. So would their malice end if more areas were patched and more instances spawned?

Basically I'm wondering if the mentioned guilds' malice is due to reaction over feeling confined themselves, or if they're purposefully monopolizing areas and instances through the camp, kill, recruit cycle.

If the guilds' behavior aren't reactionary, then I don't believe its Funcom place to do anything on a FFA server. It pretty much goes with the territory that guilds have to compete with other guilds.

Sounds like a crappy situation, but the guilds you described as doing things the "slow way" aren't stuck due to any negligence on Funcom's part. If you acknowledge a disparity between some guilds leveling "fast" and others "slow", and that the disparity comes from PvP (otherwise there'd be an inability to guard areas) well...doesn't that sound like an issue the players themselves have to deal with on a PvP server?

If not, what would you propose Funcom do in order to break this "cycle"? Seems to me it'd persist through whatever amount of content they were to add. It's PvP.

dude at level 73 your almost to the end.  Of course you gonna lose interest if you play as much as you, what other game have you payed 50.00 for recently that gave you more hours of gameplay till you got bored? makes know damn since. If you were lvl 30 and posted this thats understandable, but 73 ,  Shut the FUCK UP!

Originally posted by Cymdai

I'm going to attempt to give my own breakdown of this game, from the perspective of a level 73 player. The purpose of this is to explain my problems with this game, and what can be done to fix it.

I'm a level 73 Tempest of Set on the Deathwhisper server. I was greatly enjoying this game in the beginning stages. I found the quests to be interesting, and I liked the dialogue, the scenery, and the lore. My class wasn't unique from other MMO's, but it was interesting enough to satisfy me.

As I played this game, I hadn't ever come across any game-breaking bugs, just tons of little ones. Little things, like my weapon slowly floating away into outer space, or my characters legs disappearing, or being unable to apprentice a friend for no explainable reason.

Then came Field of the Dead (pre-patch), which legitimately made me ponder uninstalling the game. Still, I struggled through the multiple crashes before a player informed me to just turn off my audio, because that caused the game to crash. "Fine", I thought, "A petty inconvenience, but I'll manage". It was around this time I learned of the totem exploit, and how many guilds on my server were abusing the apprentice + mass totem spam technique to hit 80 very rapidly. I noticed a huge influx of 80's on the server, and while disheartened, I didn't mind. I figured Funcom would begin addressing the issue anyway.

From there, I went to Eigliophan. When I asked a good place to go, I was sent to the Cannibal Caves, where I grinded out several levels. Yes, running the same path for what was likely 12 hours was the only way to level, as many guilds on my server, notably Sadistic and the Hordes of Goonheim, had locked down the "good" leveling areas.

Onwards to Thunder river, where I noticed a significant decrease in the lack of available quests. After around my first 2 levels there, I was forced to begin the grind. Camps were extraordinarily limited, and as with Eigliophian, were highly over-camped and competitve, at all hours of the day.

So I solo'd. I solo'd several levels, and from there went to Aztel's approach. Within my first 20 minutes in Aztel, OOC was flooded with people spamming about the Gong quest, which I was estimate at last 200 people took advantage of on my server for a quick exploitable 5-8 levels. Meanwhile, I was forced to solo, as I'm in a smaller guild. You can't get certain areas, as patrols of level 80's guard the spawn points, raping anyone who dares enter their guild's grinding area. So again, I was forced to resort to soloing. It's much slower, but I needed to at least feel as though I was progressing.

But nay, it would not be the case. For guilds were even locking up the solo areas so that they could apprentice grind lower level members of their guild.

Due to a lack of options to level, I have been stuck at this level now or 2 full days, making minimal progress before getting discouraged. There aren't any quests available that I haven't done. The grind areas are so overly competitive that exp isn't gained, rather, you spend more time defending your camp than you do using it. Multiple instances don't help, as there are so few areas for groups to exp in, that they are always, always full.

And so I sit here today, and ponder why I'm playing this game.

At 73, you legitimately need to kill around 500-700 mobs to level. I don't know how many of you sympathize or care, but after killing my 500th mammoth, I just stopped caring about the game. There's no immersion there; rather a bland, repetitive, forced route that I have to endure because of areas being over-saturated by played.

 

But perhaps I just overdid it. So I'm going to take a week off. Maybe I burned out, maybe I over-grinded, maybe I didn't stop and sniff the roses. It could be my class, the effect of encountering the same, irritating little bugs over and over and over, or just me. Whatever the problem is, somewhere between 56-73, the game stopped being fun, and so much so that I can't even rightly feel like logging into the game.

What needs to change

- More leveling areas. Stop shuffling the player through content, give us options on where to level.

- Better quest rewards. 50k exp when you need almost 2 million is just not satisfactory.

- Better item drops. I don't mind grinding, when I'm getting something worthwhile. After my 4th Big Cudgel, I stop caring about checking chests

- Make PvP worthwhile. Give me some reason, ANY REASON, to PvP. At least then, competing for camps has a purpose, instead of just monotony.

- Fix the apprenticeship system to prevent abuse. Scale back exp appropriate for the level to PREVENT oversaturation of an area by a guild power-leveling level 20's in  level 60+ zone

- Test patches before they're run. The re-instancing bugs = infuriating.

- Leave up a set number of instances at all times of the day, not just when it's crowded.

- More group-friendly individual instances

- More content

 

 

Let me know if you agree or disagree with me here.

 

This game is sounding alot like Star Wars Galaxies lol,And Funcom is sounding strangely alot like SOE. There is no way I am ever buying this game designed mainly for console gamers.

Originally posted by Umbral

 

 

I really think you oversaturated yourself in the game.

It is a mistake powerlevel in a fresh released game, this may work in already expanded games as Everquest2 or Lineage2, but not in new ones.

Take a break and slowdown, you may enjoy it again.

 

...

Every beta tester would have been able to tell you that high end content was not fully tested, not yet implemented and just not ready for retail.  Thats why Funcom did not allow testers to come public and tell how things really were.

Now... Thats the gaming company you are now hearing promise this and that about the future.  Its the same gaming company that said  DX10 - spellwaving and siege warfare was held away from the Beta testers so they would have something to look forward to ...

Yes - right... Why do ppl belive one word these guys are saying?

Originally posted by Battleskar

This game is sounding alot like Star Wars Galaxies lol,And Funcom is sounding strangely alot like SOE. There is no way I am ever buying this game designed mainly for console gamers.

This game is like the opposite of SWG which was a true sandbox type of game with huge worlds incredibly complex and diverse classes.  This game is like a dumbed down guild wars that is broken with less content.

Originally posted by ghettobooste

This game is like the opposite of SWG which was a true sandbox type of game with huge worlds incredibly complex and diverse classes.  This game is like a dumbed down guild wars that is BROKEN with less content.

Emphasis on the colored word.

Originally posted by ghettobooste

Originally posted by Battleskar

This game is sounding alot like Star Wars Galaxies lol,And Funcom is sounding strangely alot like SOE. There is no way I am ever buying this game designed mainly for console gamers.

This game is like the opposite of SWG which was a true sandbox type of game with huge worlds incredibly complex and diverse classes.  This game is like a dumbed down guild wars that is broken with less content.

Originally posted by medafor

dude at level 73 your almost to the end.  Of course you gonna lose interest if you play as much as you, what other game have you payed 50.00 for recently that gave you more hours of gameplay till you got bored? makes know damn since. If you were lvl 30 and posted this thats understandable, but 73 ,  Shut the FUCK UP!

Plenty. And they worked all the way through.

Oh, and the reason I bring this to everyone's attention is because I've noticed a few people saying "This game doesn't begin until level 80", and that's simply not true. We're working on a Tier 2 City, raiding is still broken, and there isn't anything to do.

Honestly, the sad thing is, I didn't have to play that much. I just knew where to go. My guild was filled with beta folks who had nice camps marked and lined up for us.

And no, I don't believe in judging a game 1/3 of the way through it. Complaining about a game at level 30 means I haven't seen half the content. Now, I HAVE seen most of it, and I know what is and isn't working. Therefore, I have more validity to explain what is and isn't wrong with the game.

Besides. If you're complaining at level 30, my sympathies are limited, because the game is awesome until level 40 anyway.

I anticipated this one for more than a year.  I was as excited as any other person waiting for this game.

My Guardian made it to the 40s until I realized it was the most shallow game I've ever played.  Even the meatier stuff that would have kept me busy (player cities, gathering, crafting, theorycrafting) is either broken or NYI.  So last night I canceled and uninstalled.  Fastest $50 game I ever went through. 

If you like this game, awesome.  I'm glad you found enjoyment out of it.  But I am very disappointed.  To me, Funcom really dropped the ball on getting this world ready.   Hopefully in six months they'll have a great game going for you guys.  I might check back then.  But patching in the game months after you sold us the framework is unacceptable.  Shame on you, Funcom. 

I find it funny how the majority of people who claim to be burnt out are the same people who rushed to high levels or played for 12 hour play sessions. Honestly, if you don't want to burn out on a game so quickly pick up a full time job  or take it easy, the game isn't going anywhere. Every MMO in history has an early burn out factor(cept UO) if you rush it, nothing changes until more content comes in.

you posted something negative about the game, and despite justfying your subjective opinion with numerous clear and objectively described experiences, you must be labelled a troll, according to my AoC clueless fanboy handbook.