Age of Conan

Originally posted by shadenis

 

Originally posted by Ghost12

 

 

People still dont get it.

Ganking = Pvp.

I'll say it again.

Ganking = PvP.

When youre out in a FFA PvP server, people are going to gank you. Seriously, if I want to kill you, do you expect me to go:

Gost12: Yo, Evasia, my main man. You suck balls! Hey, watch out, in the next 10-20 seconds, IM GONNA ATTACK YOU!

Evasia: Shit man. Can you at least wait until I finish fighting this boss? I want his drops kk thnx.

Lol. Give me a freakin break. Thats the beauty of a PvP server. You cannot farm without watching your back, every step is made with a wandering eye. Or you can do the hunting and gank people. Either way, the freedom of being attacked or TO attack from anywhere is what makes it so great. Ganking is the essence of a FFA PvP server. People who gank are NOT cowardly, they are simply being free.

interesting, i play mmo's since UO and M59 and most mmo vets do not consider  ganking pvp.
It is rather the opposite , however , it happens in pvp but it is not how pvp should be.

 

 

PVP can be economical wars , gvg , RVR , fighting over kingdoms, turf wars etc, skirmishes , world pvp etc.

PVP= not ganking and ganking= not PVP! The one who thinks so, has not played many mmo's before in my opinion.

And sandbox is not lost in time, they are many upcoming mmo's that are going to be sandbox or are going to have both elements. EVE is also one of the successful pay to pay mmorpg's of this decade. It is sandbox and CCP does good business with it. ( CCP has 303 people already)

I completely agree that ganking is not actual PvP. It's more griefing than anything. However, I think what Ghost12 was getting at that Ganking/Griefing is apart of PvP. Anyone who cries about it obviously hasn't played many MMOs or is just a carebear who likes to think they're a PvPer or basically wants to PvP when it's convenient for them but anyone who dares to attack them when they feel like it is a noob who doesn't "know" the "rules" of PvP.

If there is PvP in a game there will be ganking, griefing, and corpse camping. If you do not like these things I suggest you stick to the PvE servers.

But I have one question for you Shadenis. What up coming MMOs are promising to be sandbox along the lines of EVE, EQ1, and SWG? I miss sandbox mmos =( and haven't heard of any being in development.

Originally posted by Ghost12

Originally posted by Ozmodan

If you don't like linear games like Dungeon Siege, don't even bother with AoC.   This game is closer to Guild Wars than a MMO with all the instancing.   Not sure what Funcom was trying to do with this game, but I think a good portion of those trying it will not stick around past 30 days.

Ive been reading many good reviews of the game which tell me otherwise. Looking at the videos that have been posted of people playing, the game looks QUITE fun.

Anyone who thinks AoC will change Wow is going to be in for a big surprise.   I have heard the game opens up after level 60, but I don't think I will stick around to experience that.

So then how can you give a fair judgement of the game if you dont experience all of it?

My old Wow guild got together(none of us have played Wow for over a year btw), we have been anticipating playing AoC for some time, we thought this would be the game.  All of us are very disappointed.  We thought this game would be like Wow where you could level together.  Instead it is more a soloer's paradise, if you like linear progression that is. 

You thought the game would be like WoW? ROFL.

While the game is beautiful, there are invisible walls everywhere so you can't stray off the path.  Once past level 20, the quests are quite monotonous and offer very little in the way of originality.

The invisible wall problem is something that is very dissapointing, I'll give you that.

Now to the pvp aspect, all of us in the gulid enjoy pvp, a lot of us started in UO and let me say that even it's heyday the ganking in UO can never hold a candle to the ganking going on on the pvp servers in AoC.    We just stopped playing on the pvp servers yesterday, the ganking just got too much to take.  We got further with our characters on the pve server anyways.

Okay, this is what pisses me off. AoC is a PVP CENTERED MMO. You seem to forget that simple fact, ESPECIALLY if your playing on a PvP server which you obviously are. In a PvP server, expect to get ganked, especially if you are in a highly populated zone. Since you are playing with all the other people that rushed to buy the game when it first came out. So guess what?

You guessed it. Since you are probably mindlessly grinding away at PvE like a sheep back in WoW, youre going to get your ass handed to you in ganks. And it really annoying to read posts like these where people probably arent thinking when they are playing a FFA PvP game such as this.

For most of us, part of the fun of a MMO is going out and exploring, well you can forget that in this game, unless it really does open up after 60, but who in the heck wants to wait that long? 

I don't know what you were thinking Funcom, but I would sure like to know why you thought linear progression and massive instancing would be a winning solution. 

By the way, on the instancing issue...

Because of the massive influx of players in zones, the game automatically creates new areas, or as we call it, "instances". This is nothing abnormal and it keeps everyone from crashing. You have to understand that with the large amount of people in these zones, you are going to experience alot of instancing in a brand new MMO such as AoC.

Our entire guild is going to wait for War in the fall, this game in our opinion completely misses what a good MMO needs.

So if you like being lead by the hand in a linear progression manner and enjoy most of the areas being instanced, have it.  This is your type of game. 

This game is about as far from being a Sandbox as you can get. 

Well, gosh man, where did you get the idea that the game was sandbox? Sandbox is a far out idea that has been lost in time.

 

Sorry no, AoC is not a PvP game. Anyone who wants to make a real PvP game avoids instances like the plague, whereas AoC has more instances than I tought possible. It has instances inside instances inside instances inside instances! That previous line was not a spelling error, nor was it an exacceration, I actually had a quest like that.

Originally posted by busdriver

Sorry no, AoC is not a PvP game. Anyone who wants to make a real PvP game avoids instances like the plague, whereas AoC has more instances than I tought possible. It has instances inside instances inside instances inside instances! That previous line was not a spelling error, nor was it an exacceration, I actually had a quest like that.

Care to elaborate on what some of these "real" pvp games are?

Oh good, another game out to bash/praise relentlessly until everyone is tired of seeing my type. I hate how it is so like/unlike WoW. The PvP stinks/is awesome and I'm so tired of being ganked/ganking someone. There is/is not any sandbox features I've been pining for since my dear departed first love SWG, may she rest in pieces /stops to cry just a little bit.

This game is SO gonna beat the pants off WoW/hurdle relentlessly into oblivion. And anybody that disagrees with me is absolutely right/a complete moron.

Originally posted by busdriver

Anyone who wants to make a real PvP game avoids instances like the plague, whereas AoC has more instances than I thought possible.

Typically I don't post, but this comment is ludicrous. The ultimate PvP game is an online shooter, in these games you join servers that have a player limit, this is effectively instancing. These limits are created for a reason and from what I've read, a 96 person limit per zone is monstrous compared to most online shooters who keep capacity around 20- 24. These limits were created so that a given map is not overfilled with players so that spam does not occur and player skill becomes more important than luck or mass numbers.

Originally posted by Demz2

Sorry when did Aoc become a PVP game????? [...]

Originally posted by Lidane

Originally posted by Ozmodan

This game is about as far from being a Sandbox as you can get. 

At what point did Funcom ever say that Age of Conan was going to be a sandbox game?

Yeah thats what I want to know too. AoC is exactly what they said it will be, for all I know. Good for them that they had a successful launch, but its not the kind of game I would ever want to play.

Originally posted by Rellek

 

Originally posted by busdriver

Anyone who wants to make a real PvP game avoids instances like the plague, whereas AoC has more instances than I thought possible.

Typically I don't post, but this comment is ludicrous. The ultimate PvP game is an online shooter, in these games you join servers that have a player limit, this is effectively instancing. These limits are created for a reason and from what I've read, a 96 person limit per zone is monstrous compared to most online shooters who keep capacity around 20- 24. These limits were created so that a given map is not overfilled with players so that spam does not occur and player skill becomes more important than luck or mass numbers.

 

You're comparing apples to oranges here. Your argument is moot. FPS's are just that. When you buy an FPS you know what you're getting into.

PvP via MMORPGs is a whole different beast. True PvP in MMORPGs can be seen in the likes of UO, EQ(RZ and SZ server) and EVE. DAoC was also a good one, but I forget if they allowed looting of any sorts...but at least they had epic battles in the game world and not in some damn instance.

Instancing PvP in MMORPGs is basically making it an FPS, and that's not the point. Battle Grounds ala WoW are pathetic last ditch efforts to try and get in the PvP group of players. They are really there for people who don't like PvP in the game world for when they actually feel like participating in PvP. These are the same people who cry about ganking/griefing when they knowingly join a PvP server.

Instancing zones screws it up even more because you now know that there are(in the case of Conan) 47 other people besides you in this zone. You know how many of your enemy are around and you know how many people will attack you or you can attack. That's not fun. What if someone ganks me? They can jsut skip and hop across to another instance and I will be blindly chasing them not know where the hell they are. How am I suppose to get revenge?

AoC is good in many aspects, but it epicly fails in the PvP department. Then again, it's not a PvP game. It's an RPG with a PvP option. You know it's true and there's nothing wrong with that....it just won't win that part of the player base.

-EDIT-

I just read that you said that the zone cap is 96 people? Well apparently no one really knows because I keep hearing conflicting numbers. First it was 100 people, then someone said that on the AoC boards they say it's 48, and now you're saying 96.

Well let's go with the argument that it's 96 people. That's lame. I want to be able to attack ANYONE that goes into THE VALLEY OF GREAT BIG NAKED BARBARIAN BREASTS, not 96 people. If there are 300 people in that zone I want to be able to see them all and kill them all.  MMORPGs are not supposed to be FPSs and to correct you on your statement how 96 is a bigger number than any FPS has ever allowed....that's a crock of shyte. Planetside which is a FPS, an MMOFPS, had HUNDREDS of players per server. 500+ if not more.

Originally posted by Retrad

 

Originally posted by Rellek

 

Typically I don't post, but this comment is ludicrous. The ultimate PvP game is an online shooter, in these games you join servers that have a player limit, this is effectively instancing. These limits are created for a reason and from what I've read, a 96 person limit per zone is monstrous compared to most online shooters who keep capacity around 20- 24. These limits were created so that a given map is not overfilled with players so that spam does not occur and player skill becomes more important than luck or mass numbers.

 

 

Well let's go with the argument that it's 96 people. That's lame. I want to be able to attack ANYONE that goes into THE VALLEY OF GREAT BIG NAKED BARBARIAN BREASTS, not 96 people. If there are 300 people in that zone I want to be able to see them all and kill them all.  MMORPGs are not supposed to be FPSs and to correct you on your statement how 96 is a bigger number than any FPS has ever allowed....that's a crock of shyte. Planetside which is a FPS, an MMOFPS, had HUNDREDS of players per server. 500+ if not more.

I'm not arguing whether or not AoC is a PvP game, becuase I have yet to play it and have no solid base from which to argue. However, I can argue against the concept of PvP, of which is not comparing apples and oranges. The bare bones of an fps is simply a game mechanic, and a mechanic that is very hard to implement in a mmo. If you remove the mechanics, you are left with a group of people who are either out to beat the snot out of each other, or team up and fight side by side. Either way you still have players versus player, the only difference is that in a mmorpg, a player can build a stronger character and face those of both higher and lower strength. In a FPS, that is stripped away and depending on the game you are playing, all that matters is skill and map control.

The real reason you limit the amount of players in a scenario is to restrict the amount of chaos created.  (And the amount of strain on the server) This is very important when dealing with PvP, as the more players that are presented, the less skill matters and the more a player loses thier individuality, the less an individuals actions matter. I prefer small skirmishes, but that is my personal preference; however, I can understand why people would like to have more players in a zone/instance/server. Hopefully, since the game came out, they will be able to expand the amount allowed within a zone.

Typically, how large are the battles in the open-world pvp?