WAR (Warhammer Online)

For starters let me warn you that I most likely will say something to offend at the very least one of you. And thats ok, because I dont care :)
Obviously this is my opinion and its worth what its worth.

One more thing before I begin, my grahmar is terrible so if my "theres" and "theirs" and "theyres" get messed up--get over it.

As a small background, my first mmo was shadowbane, I went from Shadowbane to the RvR of DAOC, did a brief stint in SWG and onto WoW. I have predominantly played caster or ranged charachters. Many call them Glass cannons. I wouldnt have it any other way.

In practically every mmo Ive played, stealthers were weak or in time broken. They were always weak in Shadowbane. Dont let any leet, hardcore, basement living nub tell you any different.

In DAOC they were overpowered without a doubt. Casters had nothing to do once a half decent rogue was on you.

In WoW, I know the word BALANCE is laughable, but I have to honestly say they have given everyone a way to get out of all the CC and its fairly balanced now. At the very least more so that any other SOLID mmo+pvp Ive played.

And with that brief synopsis behind us, my opinion :)

I think its a cop out on Mythics part to not have Stealthers.

I think they caved from the tidal wave of tears about stealthers.
If you cry about a stealther or dont like the idea, or feel that its unfair--just realize that your a emobaby. Once youve come to grips with that fact-- get over it and roll "said hated class" whether its a stealther or like in WoW a Hunter (god I hate hunters, its ok, see Im a emo baby too :P)

Back to a more logical train of thought though.

Stealthers add another layer of RvR like they did in DAOC.
And Although in daoc they were overpowered, in a good group stealthers could protect the softie casters and warn you of where they were because in DAOC stealthers could see other stealthers, or at least a whole HELL of a lot better than you could and this in turned added another layer of pvp/rvr.

I know one of you warhammer, leet boardplaying-uber-nerds is gonna tell me how its not in the IP. You know what? I COULDNT GIVE a BLEEP what is and what isnt in a IP. WIthout EAMythic, Warhammer is nonexistent as a successful mmo.

If warhammer is about WAR and PVP then lets KEEP what has BEEN IN ALL GREAT MMOS. And before someone mentions that people cant go invis in real warfare, well answer me this, whens the last time youve seen someone shoot fire out of there fingertips? Point being that its FANTASY!! IP's can be bent by the company with the most money.

For many hardcore players, its in there nature to play a stealther. Thats what they like, thats what theyve gotten good at, thats what theyve tailored there skill set around. If there were no melee in Warhammer what would you think about that? Or if there were NO casters or NO healers in game--what would you think if that was your favorite class to play?

k rants over

Im tired, worked for the last 7 days straight and have 5 more to go before I can sleep in--- sooo FLAME AWAY :)

Your not very up to date are you?  They're testing an implementation of stealth ... 1 for Order and 1 for Destruction..and it won't be like WoW stealth or DAoC stealth...though there's no word on if it'll make it to launch. 

I for one hate stealth..but only because the implimentations that I've witnessed and had to deal with were heavily exploitable and made the entire play experience for everyone incredibly unfun.  Stealth shouldn't be a way to gank fiesta your way through the game...simply a tool to help lighter characters get into a battle without being completely obliterated.

I must ask, why do you care so much if you dont even play a stealthy class? another thing to think about is that if you look at past MMO's and even a statement by EA/Mythic about DAoC, you will see that stealth layer has NEVER been successful in any MMO out there. Yes, it satisfies the addiction for those few that like sneaking around like ninjas, but ultimately devs are ALWAYS balancing out stealthers and thus creating that vicious cycle of balancing that most MMO's get stuck in and never come out of. I think it's actually about time they got rid of class that takes no skill, i mean c'mon how hard is it to stealth run up to a guy AMBUSHSINISTERSINISTERSINISTER and hope to kill him before you die? (ok i dumbed it up a bit but you know what i mean) Getting rid of stealthers is garunteed a risky move but i completely feel as tho it will only help to improve the overall quality of the game. And you know what, if all those stealther nub guys leave for another game, FINE everyone else will be much happier!

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Originally posted by elvenangel
Your not very up to date are you?  They're testing an implementation of stealth ... 1 for Order and 1 for Destruction..and it won't be like WoW stealth or DAoC stealth...though there's no word on if it'll make it to launch. 
 
I for one hate stealth..but only because the implimentations that I've witnessed and had to deal with were heavily exploitable and made the entire play experience for everyone incredibly unfun.  Stealth shouldn't be a way to gank fiesta your way through the game...simply a tool to help lighter characters get into a battle without being completely obliterated.

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What I read was that stealth will in no way be like it is in WoW or DAOC.
Exactly what that is, is ofcourse speculation. But what I heard was... half stealth, not being able to see them at range but seeing them partway invis once they get close...and that seemed lame. Again, thats the only thing that I could think that would actually fit that bill.

Although I do think stealthers were overpowered in daoc as I mentioned before I hardly ever saw the gank fiesta that you spoke of. If I was alone, I was almost certainly dead.

But in a group, I usually lived.

I take you two are of the crowd that loathe WoW?

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Originally posted by mrwasted
I must ask, why do you care so much if you dont even play a stealthy class? another thing to think about is that if you look at past MMO's and even a statement by EA/Mythic about DAoC, you will see that stealth layer has NEVER been successful in any MMO out there. Yes, it satisfies the addiction for those few that like sneaking around like ninjas, but ultimately devs are ALWAYS balancing out stealthers and thus creating that vicious cycle of balancing that most MMO's get stuck in and never come out of. I think it's actually about time they got rid of class that takes no skill, i mean c'mon how hard is it to stealth run up to a guy AMBUSHSINISTERSINISTERSINISTER and hope to kill him before you die? (ok i dumbed it up a bit but you know what i mean) Getting rid of stealthers is garunteed a risky move but i completely feel as tho it will only help to improve the overall quality of the game. And you know what, if all those stealther nub guys leave for another game, FINE everyone else will be much happier!

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Mr Wasted and to both of you ty for being so kind when I was being a ass. Im tired and cranky and Im not all for "No stealth" in WAR like some people are. Since Im not a stealther you brought up a very good point. Why do I care?

Guess its in my nature. I also dont like corrupt foreign governments that take advantage of there citizens. Why do I care? Im not chinese right? (just an example).

Other reason being, the stealther as a whole has been a part of mmos for a long time. I hate to see it go if that is in fact what happens.

I agree that it is hard to balance. Either there weak or there overpowered..it goes back and forth.

I have to ask though when you last played WoW? The game is much different. Resilience has broken classes that are glass cannonish whether they be the melee form = Rogues or the caster form = Mages. WoW has fixed somethings but surprisingly the classes that were the most broke in pvp are now some of the strongest. Basically the tables were turned 180 degrees on the dps classes. No one can burn anyone down anymore.

I play a ice mage. I can kite 2 rogues around all day, kill one and get away from teh other and probably kill him too if he has the balls to keep chasing me (all the while my cooldowns are coming up)

But even way back when, I think your exagerating how "little skill" it takes to play a rogue. And lets get one major thing straight, NO CLASS TAKES SKILL. Every class Ive played and learned has at one point felt easy. Its just a way to play..a strategy. Every toon plays differently. Once you learn the rhythym and the flow whose to say that one class is harder to play than another?

Although and in some way I guess im contradicting myself, I will say that in Blizzards feable attempts to make WoW better they have taken the "easier to play" SIMPLE classes and made them stronger than the classes that take more finesse and timing. Its like sticking a better driver into a pinto and expecting him to win because hes a better driver. The with the ferrari who has but an ounce of skill is going to win and prolly think hes the best driver in the world.

Obviously Im still looking forward to the game. I hope they blow me away with there NEW stealth idea. Who knows, maybe it will be great.

Later

either you agree....

or my posts were entirely too long to have the attention span to read thru :P

I do actually have to work when im reading these threads rofl so some just get shuffled to the Eh whatever ranks lol No offense :) And don't worry on the crankiness we all have those days!

Okay here's my take on stealth.

It's part of warfare, hell it's becoming the center of modern warfare.

But vanishing in the middle of an open field with 10 people looking at you is frickin stupid. Why can't you just hide behind a building? Why not hide behind a tree and ambush someone? That's stealth isn't it, or is it not because you don't press a button?

Why don't you be creative and put a different spin on it.

Edit: I suppose these kinds of tactics aren't practiced much in MMOs because they're based on gear and abilities not skill and strategy. But that's something I hope WAR can change. And, I agree with light stealth, i.e. blending into shadows or camoflauge, but it should be easily detectable when you're up close and should only offer a slight advantage.

Aw np man, I guess I was expecting to be flamed up one side and down the other and when that didnt happen, left me scratching my head.

I guess I just dont have it in me to be controversial.

Back to the posts and a few of my concerns unrelated to stealt