Lord of the Rings Online

Originally posted by BigMango

 

Originally posted by WSIMike

 Hmmm.... I like what you are saying

Maybe I could try another 30 day subscription. Tell me, have they improved the fighter combat animations, the combat feeling within the past year ? Is there now some feeling in the combat ? Do you now "feel" it when you hit something?. Because 1 year ago it was very bland, the "feeling" was missing.

Hmm.... I think I understand what you're getting at, but it would be difficult for me to give an answer to that because what you consider "feeling", I might not, or vice versa. Do you feel in terms of it hurting when you're hit, or potentially when you hit someone? Well, on my Hunter, I know that when I'm using special attacks with my bow, my character "leans into it" - if you know what I mean, I know that I hear the arrow let fly and hear a distinct "thud" when it hits its target - many times with the target recoiling from it.

Haven't really played a fighter class so much, so hard to say there.

I was surprised a couple weeks ago when I tried the DDO trial. That game was also made by Turbine, but in DDO playing as a fighter is awesome. When you use your sword the movement is fast, you hear it, and you feel it when you are hitting something. It's strage it is (was?) so bland in lotro.

I tried DDO a while back - shortly after it launched - so I don't really remember how it was enough to make a comparison. Perhaps I could try a trial (ha!) and see. Been curious how that games' coming along recently anyway.

Originally posted by BigMango

 

 As I said I see a great opportunity missed to make something awesome, that could make everyone happy, playable as only pve, or pve-pvp, or only pvp (yes only pvp is possible, i.ex in shaiya you get xp when killing player opponents and you also have quests and dungeons on the pvp maps; in the pve you even have quests that send you killing pvp opponents ). But that's of course my opinion.

 

I think when people state that the lore wouldn't support it, it's more a response to the idea of open world PvP. In that case, people are correct.

Honestly, I think with PvP it boils down to a decision - do they want it to have PvP, or not. And if so, how much? In Turbine's case, they decided early on that PvP would not be an inherent part of the main gameplay. And so it isn't.

At first, as I recall,  LoTRO was not to have PvP at all. That simply is not the kind of game they are/were seeking to create. Then later, I suppose in response to enough people showing interest, they had to make a decision... Could they implement PvP in a non-invasive way that would provide those players the competitive gameplay they sought, without up-ending or fundamentally changing the core gameplay in the process?

I believe PvMP as their solution was quite brilliant.PvMP is implemented as a 100% optional side activity.  You can PvP without affecting at all the flow of things in the main PvE game. Freeps can bring their characters in at will, still playing as the "good guys". Creeps can do their thing, and it all happens in a way that does not bleed over into the PvE content, the main game. It's separate enough that no matter how hostile things get in the 'moors - or any new PvMP areas they add later - once a player has had their fill and leaves that PvP enabled area, they are back to the key PvE experience Turbine is most focused on.

Turbine are clearly being ever-so-careful to not screw with the core gameplay in LoTRO, while still trying to meet the players half-way where they can; and to their credit.

In closing, I think it's best when a MMO dev focuses most on one or the other and doesn't try to please all sides. More times than not, trying to please everyone equally in a MMO fails, because it's seldom ever "good enough" for either side.

Originally posted by Orthedos

I was just saying, while we have no say in the game development, we still might find it interesting to ask hypothetically, what might be fun to add to the current gameplay.  Sure, Turbine or Tolkine need not listen, most likely they won't.  But as an intellectual exercise, it might be fun discussing options and possibilities.

While I don't mean to offend your seeking intellectual discourse on what could be with the LoTRO, I fear those types of conversations, because with the last two MMO's I played that is how the initiation of change begins.  Before you know it, some new crack team of designers come in, coupled with their own ideas of how the game should progress, and then choose to read a few forums (to "gauge" what the customers want), and bam it is something totally different from the original view.

Everquest is now morphed into some half thought up set of ideas that have no lore or direction as it began.  Each expansion corrupted the game a little more, then after SOE took over they kept shifting designers around so that you couldn't get a congruent story line if you tried.  And talk to dedication Warcraft players, the same has happened to it, the lore is totally abandoned from the original story lines.

I am happy with the state of the game now, I love the lore, and I love the innovations that Turbine places into the game.  I fear that if a new crack team comes in before you know it we will have a space ship crash land into middle earth and demons will come forth in an invasion straight out of hell and the lorekeepers will accidently open a rift in the space time continuem that will open a land of never dreamed beings that wreak havoc and darkness upon the land.  Ya, talking about what could be scares me to be frank.  But feel free, you have the right to say any input you feel, just expect me to give mine in return. 

Originally posted by WSIMike

 

Originally posted by eccoton

I come here to talk about mmos and be entertained by the range of relies. You have a history of long replies pointing out flaws in others posts. That seems to be your enjoyment here. Which is great, makes for a good read. However I think most of the people who post here are pretty smart and can see flaws, sarcasm, humor, trolling, etc, etc, etc. on their own. If you decide to reply could you use red for your relies rather the light blue. Red will make it seem more exciting!

 

I wouldn't say I "failed" to get your point, or catch your sarcasm. I'd say you failed pretty thoroughly to convey either.

There is absolutely nothing in your post that I quoted or responded to that indicates anything you are claiming it does. There's no use of quotes, or obvious exaggeration or anything of the sort to indicate anything you say in your post is at all sarcastic or facetious.  Not even a follow-up like "See what I did there?", or (/sarcasm off).

I'm sure you realize that in text, the tone or intent of a statement, including sarcasm, is easily lost without any such qualifier.

Had you done more to make your intended tone more obvious, not I nor likely anyone else would have missed it.

For the record, yes, I do tend to call people out for what they say in their posts (or on what they say in real life). Not so much out of "enjoyment" though. I loathe intellectual dishonesty, blatant/blind bias and spin-doctoring (little wonder I stopped listening to politicians or taking them seriously).

I did get the condescension and sarcasm in your "you should use red" statement. Unfortunately, it was a pretty weak attempt.

Ummm the "red" comment was not sarcasm. I meant it. Red stands out more that is all. Not everything has deep dark meanings. You certianly pointed that out about my writing style in this post.

What I did was try to express my feelings about the OPs claims on WoW it's fan base and LOTRO. It was also filled with gross generalizations. I tried to present the idea in a similar way as the OP because I found it a bit of a put down to WoW players. Successful or not I stand by all my opinions on both LOTRO and WoW.  However, this was not a deep ironic poke at the OP. I was not trying to express a wildly intellectual attack on the OP. If you read other of my posts I rarely do that. I am not that smart, I just like to talk about mmos. I try to do that in a variety of ways. I am a little suprised someone who writes as well as you do took my posts here so seriously. I am not a writer by profession I just like to try to express myself in a variety of ways on these forums. I am an artist by profession. I for one do not ever call people "out" I just do not feel the need. We all express ourselves in the way we seem fit. Who am I to tell people they are wrong or my way is better. One good thing with that approach to life (and mmos) is it makes for a more stress free life. Most just read the posts agree or disagree and move on, since everything here is "opinion".

Originally posted by WSIMike

 

Originally posted by BigMango

 

 As I said I see a great opportunity missed to make something awesome, that could make everyone happy, playable as only pve, or pve-pvp, or only pvp (yes only pvp is possible, i.ex in shaiya you get xp when killing player opponents and you also have quests and dungeons on the pvp maps; in the pve you even have quests that send you killing pvp opponents ). But that's of course my opinion.

 

 

I think when people state that the lore wouldn't support it, it's more a response to the idea of open world PvP. In that case, people are correct.

Honestly, I think with PvP it boils down to a decision - do they want it to have PvP, or not. And if so, how much? In Turbine's case, they decided early on that PvP would not be an inherent part of the main gameplay. And so it isn't.

At first, as I recall,  LoTRO was not to have PvP at all. That simply is not the kind of game they are/were seeking to create. Then later, I suppose in response to enough people showing interest, they had to make a decision... Could they implement PvP in a non-invasive way that would provide those players the competitive gameplay they sought, without up-ending or fundamentally changing the core gameplay in the process?

I believe PvMP as their solution was quite brilliant.PvMP is implemented as a 100% optional side activity.  You can PvP without affecting at all the flow of things in the main PvE game. Freeps can bring their characters in at will, still playing as the "good guys". Creeps can do their thing, and it all happens in a way that does not bleed over into the PvE content, the main game. It's separate enough that no matter how hostile things get in the 'moors - or any new PvMP areas they add later - once a player has had their fill and leaves that PvP enabled area, they are back to the key PvE experience Turbine is most focused on.

Turbine are clearly being ever-so-careful to not screw with the core gameplay in LoTRO, while still trying to meet the players half-way where they can; and to their credit.

In closing, I think it's best when a MMO dev focuses most on one or the other and doesn't try to please all sides. More times than not, trying to please everyone equally in a MMO fails, because it's seldom ever "good enough" for either side.

 

Absolutely spot on commentary, especially concerning "pleasing all of the people all of the time". Quite simply, you can't and Turbine's approach is the ONLY approach. If we look at other games that have diametrically changed themselves to cater to a certain demographic while ignoring or marginalising the original demographic, they usually end up with neither. LotrO has done a very good job of catering to everyone while making sure that one type of play does not directly interfere with another.

S

So whats the verdict exactly on LOTR? Since i quit WoW (due to the fact that if i left my account active i would play the game way too much and be too pressured to raid/arena when I had work to do--it had nothing to do with the game itself) I've been looking for a new MMO that I could play casually and pressure free, since I'd essentially just be playing on my own and for myself, not with friends.

I tried EQ2 for almost a month, and quit that because I really couldn't get myself past level 30 due to the terrible organization of questing hubs, itemization (there was one new starting quest area that basically gave you gear that you were forced to use until level 40 because Sony didn't bother balancing the rest of the questing gear), and the fact that the dungeons weren't really instanced, which was something i really liked about WoW, not having to fight other groups for boss spawns. 

EQ2 was also crappy in that there was virtually no pvp but i've kind of come to terms with the fact that WoW or maybe Guild Wars will be the only games that  focus and do well with PvP until Warhammer comes out.

So how is LOTR compared to other MMOs? The graphics look amazing and gameplay looks pretty easy to grasp. Are the quests pretty organized and soloable (as in you don't log in for 2 hours and spend the entire time trying to figure out where one or two quests are, or trying to find a group)?  Is the game interesting enough outside of grinding to keep you immersed and able to keep playing? Are there generally a lot of dungeons as you level, if you wanted to play in a group for a while?

Originally posted by klaiklai

So whats the verdict exactly on LOTR? Since i quit WoW (due to the fact that if i left my account active i would play the game way too much and be too pressured to raid/arena when I had work to do--it had nothing to do with the game itself) I've been looking for a new MMO that I could play casually and pressure free, since I'd essentially just be playing on my own and for myself, not with friends.

I tried EQ2 for almost a month, and quit that because I really couldn't get myself past level 30 due to the terrible organization of questing hubs, itemization (there was one new starting quest area that basically gave you gear that you were forced to use until level 40 because Sony didn't bother balancing the rest of the questing gear), and the fact that the dungeons weren't really instanced, which was something i really liked about WoW, not having to fight other groups for boss spawns. 

EQ2 was also crappy in that there was virtually no pvp but i've kind of come to terms with the fact that WoW or maybe Guild Wars will be the only games that  focus and do well with PvP until Warhammer comes out.

So how is LOTR compared to other MMOs? The graphics look amazing and gameplay looks pretty easy to grasp. Are the quests pretty organized and soloable (as in you don't log in for 2 hours and spend the entire time trying to figure out where one or two quests are, or trying to find a group)?  Is the game interesting enough outside of grinding to keep you immersed and able to keep playing? Are there generally a lot of dungeons as you level, if you wanted to play in a group for a while?

 

yes, LOTRO is very casual friendly.  It sounds like it would be right up your ally.