WAR (Warhammer Online)

As a former DAoC player, I find it rather conspicuous that in all the talk about siege weapons and taking keeps, destructible walls are completely left out of the conversation.

Which begs the question: Will we be able to destroy walls like we did in DAoC keeps? Or are we all forced to hammer on doors?

Just curious if this has been addressed.

Tier 3 is where you start seeing walls and other obstacles.  You can't fully destroy them..this was done for performance reasons, you can how ever smash the doors & gates in.   I've seen footage of what door smashing looks like and its pretty cool lol.

If you can't destroy walls, then the whole idea of sieging keeps is useless. Destroying walls in DAoC allowed strategic vantage points while attacking. It will be extremely difficult to take a keep with only one entry point.

Performance issues? I hope they mean server side, because if people want to play new games, then they need to start upgrading their rigs. Nobody is saying you need top of the line crap, even low/mid ranged machines will be able to support most of whats out there.

Please with the dated graphics they are running there should be no performance issues I mean Battlefield bad company has destruction and 24 players on a 360 so i'm sure they can do it in this game seeing as they'll be instanced.

Hopefully Mythic arn't as useless as SOE at programming.

Originally posted by tempestormer

If you can't destroy walls, then the whole idea of sieging keeps is useless. Destroying walls in DAoC allowed strategic vantage points while attacking. It will be extremely difficult to take a keep with only one entry point.

Performance issues? I hope they mean server side, because if people want to play new games, then they need to start upgrading their rigs. Nobody is saying you need top of the line crap, even low/mid ranged machines will be able to support most of whats out there.

^^ That.

I don't understand why they can do it in DAoC with the exact same engine behind it, but can't do it in WAR. Maybe they just don't want to bother with LoS issues again?

Originally posted by vickypollard

Please with the dated graphics they are running there should be no performance issues I mean Battlefield bad company has destruction and 24 players on a 360 so i'm sure they can do it in this game seeing as they'll be instanced.

Hopefully Mythic arn't as useless as SOE at programming.

Just thought I'd highlight that part...WE're talking 200 or more players..even near a thousand in an area seiging and rvring.  Having deformable terrain that has to immediately replace itself for the next attack and 200 somethign players having to register the update is crazy talk even with modern computers. 

It would be cool if you could tear down the walls but they've explained clearly why they dont have it.   If you've seen any of the keep pictures the doors aren't just tiny lil holes to run through you can easily fit 10 people across a gateway into a keep. 

KEEPS are not Instanced.  THEY are open world!   There are some Scenarios that have Keeps but the main IMPORTANT keeps are Open World meaning anyone can run by and try to take it or get killed by just running by it.   

This is why your thoughts and opinions are highly critizied Vicky because you come here and spew crap that isn't even up  to date or true.

Originally posted by elvenangel

 

Originally posted by vickypollard

Please with the dated graphics they are running there should be no performance issues I mean Battlefield bad company has destruction and 24 players on a 360 so i'm sure they can do it in this game seeing as they'll be instanced.

Hopefully Mythic arn't as useless as SOE at programming.

Just thought I'd highlight that part...WE're talking 200 or more players..even near a thousand in an area seiging and rvring.  Having deformable terrain that has to immediately replace itself for the next attack and 200 somethign players having to register the update is crazy talk even with modern computers. 

 

It would be cool if you could tear down the walls but they've explained clearly why they dont have it.   If you've seen any of the keep pictures the doors aren't just tiny lil holes to run through you can easily fit 10 people across a gateway into a keep. 

Lol, though I'm with you on most things elvenangel, I hafta disagree here...

You don't need a full realistic physics simulation to have destructible walls. You can have a few different replaceable models for each section of the wall depending on how much hp it has got left. The transition between "wall damaged but still standing" and "a pile of rubble you can clamber over" may be conveniently obscured by a nice spectacular cloud of debris. They'd be at least as easy to program and animate as your standard doors.

IMO, destructible walls should definitely be in the game since they add replayability and variety to keep sieges. If they were implemented in DAoC with 200+ players, I see no reason whatsoever why they shouldn't be in WAR.

and oh yeah, vickypollard - WAR sieges won't be instanced, they're all open world. Please read up on the subject a bit more before posting.

Originally posted by markoraos

 

Originally posted by elvenangel

 

Originally posted by vickypollard

Please with the dated graphics they are running there should be no performance issues I mean Battlefield bad company has destruction and 24 players on a 360 so i'm sure they can do it in this game seeing as they'll be instanced.

Hopefully Mythic arn't as useless as SOE at programming.

Just thought I'd highlight that part...WE're talking 200 or more players..even near a thousand in an area seiging and rvring.  Having deformable terrain that has to immediately replace itself for the next attack and 200 somethign players having to register the update is crazy talk even with modern computers. 

 

It would be cool if you could tear down the walls but they've explained clearly why they dont have it.   If you've seen any of the keep pictures the doors aren't just tiny lil holes to run through you can easily fit 10 people across a gateway into a keep. 

 

Lol, though I'm with you on most things elvenangel, I hafta disagree here...

You don't need a full realistic physics simulation to have destructible walls. You can have a few different replaceable models for each section of the wall depending on how much hp it has got left. The transition between "wall damaged but still standing" and "a pile of rubble you can clamber over" may be conveniently obscured by a nice spectacular cloud of debris. They'd be at least as easy to program and animate as your standard doors.

IMO, destructible walls should definitely be in the game since they add replayability and variety to keep sieges. If they were implemented in DAoC with 200+ players, I see no reason whatsoever why they shouldn't be in WAR.

 

and oh yeah, vickypollard - WAR sieges won't be instanced, they're all open world. Please read up on the subject a bit more before posting.

Having had to implement stuff like this for my own job it does actually pose huge problems especially with collision & line of sight since you have to increase the amount of searches & checks for each player's line of sight and collision with terrain that changes.  Trust me It'd be awsome if it was in but I could see it causing alot of network overhead & lag to compute that sort of information back and forth between several hundred players. Work like that would be completely server side.

You may make a cool set of models to switch between but everytime a player tries to move through shoot over or through those newly opened spots the server then has to find that model and using a set of planes, triangles, normals and all those other good mathmatical goodies check every single possible scenario of where the player's collision could be at.   Its expensive enough just doing it for say 10 to 20 people if you had 200 to 400 people all trying this stuff simulatenously of within a few cycles of each other it becomes mass expensive on the server. 

These things are already done in DAoC and I've seen lots of stories of pretty 'slide show' fights..and I'd prefer to limit what the terrain is doing with the players interaction in order to avoid slide show. 

Originally posted by elvenangel

 Having had to implement stuff like this for my own job it does actually pose huge problems especially with collision & line of sight since you have to increase