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3/11/07 12:35:02 PM#21
Originally posted by RodgerPW aye same here, the way the game mechanics worked it encouraged large scale coop, even among strangers, to accomplish things together that actaully significantly altered the world you lived in. revolutionary. |
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3/11/07 1:00:20 PM#22
Originally posted by xauss alas i think the whole mess is so tied up in lawyers and red tape now that no one will ever touch it. The best one can hope for is that some mmog designer who played HZ incorporates some of the same types of systems in a whole new gameworld. Or how about this... dedicated, influential players in new mmos *cough*AoC*cough* On another topic - did Peter S. Beagle have a good experience working with HZ? Did he get paid? Was he satisfied with how his work was implemented? imo the genre needs more Professional Storytellers because, just like voice-acting, there's a difference between James Earl Jones and some guys brother-in-law. |
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3/11/07 4:54:45 PM#23
It is dishearting to see how far the game has fallen with the new management. I would really like to see another mmo developer provide us with playable dragons/drakes beyond vapor-ware. |
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3/12/07 9:07:48 AM#24
Originally posted by Axefall So true. EI. I curse the name. Funny story. For a time after they took over, I was an avid EI flamer on the Horizons boards. Then, after the censorship, er, "strictly enforced moderation" started, or I got banned from the forums (I forget if I ever did), I quit the game (which was a pain in an of itself). 2 months later I got a personal email from Dr. What's-his-name (Trask?) from EI, flaming ME, telling me to stop badgering them, and that I've never even paid a monthly fee (total BS). I replied, saying, as usual, you don't have any of your facts straight, about anything, and that I'm been a paying customer since such and such, it took me 1-2 months of hell just to cancel, and I haven't posted a single message to the forums in over 2 months. I said, you can't even get a single point of my case right, and you think you can run a game like Horizons? Never got a response. Lol.. They're a total Micky-Mouse company. Is there a single thing they did right after acquiring the game? I wish EI could sell the game to a great dev team backed back big money and re-release the game, but they're too stupid for that. They would rather completely bury the game first. I like the comment someone made about how they fired, or, "did not retain" any of the current dev staff. I'm a developer, so once I saw that, I knew there would never be a new engine or bug fixes anytime in the near (or distant) future, and that's when I decided the game was dead (and quit), thanks to EI. Also, EI made public statements that the game engine ran fine! and had no plans to change anything, that's another point when I knew they were clueless. I'm all worked up now.  |
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xauss
 Novice Member
Joined: 12/05/05
why do today, that which you can put off till tomorrow |
keep posting any stuff you think may be relevant to add / change in the OP
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4/19/07 1:30:10 AM#26
i can only hope that anyone in billing loses their jobs, wives, homes, whatever. they deserve it. that statement isnt hate, just a wish on the folks that screwed me o so long ago, and are now screwing others, my previous posts, some old, warned of this very thing. burn in hell horizons, hope you folks all lose your jobs.
now....can i say i told ya so? can you smell that?!!...............there is nothing quite like it.....................the smell of troll in the morning............i love that smell. |
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Menkure
Novice Member
Joined: 10/28/06
Moderator for the Official Horizons community forums |
5/02/07 5:01:25 PM#27
Originally posted by xauss Xauss, The Expansion was not a rumor. The team had been speaking about plans for an expansion for some time prior to the sale. However, back then the dev team knew that certain things had to be fixed and special conditions needed to be met before they started work on it. As the subscriptions started to rise, and major progress had been made towards bug fixes, the idea of a potential expansion went from simple discussion ("Ya know.. it would be really neat..") to preliminary planning and design. Tulga was also in the midst of writing a new client for Horizons, and the expansion was planned to coincide with the new client release. Bear in mind though that the new client (and the expansion) was not going to be seen for several months into the future, and the employees at Tulga knew this. Baker informed Bowman of his interest to sell, and Bowman looked into possible counter-offers. He did try telling Baker of the increased subscriptions and the progress they were making, however to my understanding of the situation.. Baker wanted out, and was willing to take anything he could get (but was very untrusting of Bowman). Chris T. Baker is a businessman. Plain and simple. And just like any businessman, he saw the short-term... combined with the past efforts of Tulga. While Tulga and the game had improved a lot prior to E3 2006, the year and a half prior to that was laided with debt. Who really knows if the expansion and new client would have helped things or not.. but obviously Baker didn't think it would overall. From what I have gathered from speaking to past employees, I tend to think that Bowman didn't really consider Baker's intent to sell as something serious. However, when the agent working for Baker introduced Mr. Andercheck to Bowman at the E3 conference, I think it was then that it hit home. Bear in mind that it was at E3 that the expansion was announced, and it was announced before the meeting with Andercheck took place. I know Bowman and the team were left scrambling after that to try and convince Baker that selling was not in the best interests of both the game and the community it had, but Baker was not listening. EI was the only interested party, and Baker took a gamble. In my opinion, Baker is just as much at fault and to blame as EI is for the destruction of Horizons. He saw Horizons not for its potential or the wonderful community it had (a community that was beginning to grow since the bankruptcy), but as an item riddled with debt. He sold it, wanting to get whatever money out of it that he could, all the while not realizing that he was also selling a community.. ....and in doing so he destroyed that community. Oh I know... it was EI's actions (their complete incompetence and ineptitude) that destroyed that community.. but it was Baker that ultimately signed the death warrant. While the community lays torn asundered, it is nice to know that Baker didn't get one cent from EI... As for the expansion... not gonna happen. What else is there to say about it? -Menkure ((edit: spelling)) |
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xauss
Novice Member
Joined: 12/05/05
why do today, that which you can put off till tomorrow |
hehe thx for the post Menkure... i guess i am just far too cynical, and took 2 +2 and jumped to 'it was all a scam'. though if the expac and client were really in the pipeline, Bakers timing could have been better. but I cant really blame Baker for selling a loss making 'investment' though
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Menkure
Novice Member
Joined: 10/28/06
Moderator for the Official Horizons community forums |
5/04/07 4:27:37 AM#29
Actually xauss, you have a right to be cynical. There were a lot of promises made back in beta, and right after release, of features which didn't make it into the game, or did make it in but months (and even years) afterwords.
I guess Baker should not be faulted for wanting out.. however, he didn't do his homework. He was stupid, and instead of getting something out of it (Heck, even anything), he got nothing but even more heartache. What I hate is that the community suffered because of it. I had a lot of friends suddenly turn enemies.. people who once were fanbois turn slambois.. people who once praised Tulga for the wonderful work they were doing right before the sale, turn and slam them afterwords for being "incompetent".. and then praise EI, claiming they were the game's savior and only hope. *HAH!* And I especially hate it that a good number of people were robbed and cheated out of money.. their money, which they worked hard for! Many of those who were screwed were even further insulted by bans and deletion of characters, all because EI couldn't admit that they screwed up.. And now, Blight is gone.. Unity isn't gonna happen.. PERIOD. And while the fault lies upon EI Interactive, Mr. Andercheck, and Dr. Rask for this, a good portion of that blame lies on the shoulders of Mr. Baker, for it was HE that signed the death warrant. -Menkure |
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5/07/07 7:33:46 PM#30
As an ex-FAN of this wonderful potentially great game it was sad learning that inept unprofessional management turned the game into crap sludge. It is here in Horizon's community that I met a lot of my good long time friends. If only the management of this game were to put aside their bickering and mistrust and worked on the game in earnest they might have turned this game into a fat cash cow that they could retire on, instead they ruined their own reputation and is the subject of redicule in almost every Horizon discussion I have read on the net. Greed = the road to destruction. |
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Menkure
Novice Member
Joined: 10/28/06
Moderator for the Official Horizons community forums |
5/07/07 9:02:14 PM#31
xauss, I just read a post by Smeglor on another forum (one where the ex-devs of Tulga are rather active posters on). He had this to say about the expansion.. which also corrects some of the info that I was going on:
I guess it isn't suprising that Baker ordered it.. but as so, it would not have been to get more subscriptions, but instead raise interest in the company in hopes of finding a buyer. Sad shame. -Menkure |
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5/08/07 5:16:33 PM#32
Poor Horizons. This was one of my favorite games with a great community and some excellent ideas. I played for months, then the billing debacle started and I still miss it. This nightmare ranks right up there with SWG's horrorshow. Both my favorite games...gone. Oh yeah, and my first MMO was still-beloved EnB. Unlucky in love, unlucky in gaming. -- Xix |
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5/13/07 12:25:31 AM#33
This game really had so much potential. Player built towns, player-dragons, the promise of large-scale world events... They were offering an unheard of degree of player control over the gameworld - and what they achieved in this respect is something even many new mmos fail to reach. But they failed in nearly every other respect with this game. The lag was always awful, combat tedious, buggier than an entomologist's wet-dream and crafting... oh god stab me in the eye with a fork. And then all the billing issues... well let's just call it was it is - theft. It will probably always be an oddity in the mmo world. They took elements proven to work well in other mmos, broke all of them, then laid their really wonderful innovations on top. It's a bit like designing a new super-aerodynamic helmet for a cyclist... then breaking both his legs before the race. If books are ever written on the history of mmos, Horizons will undoubtedly have a chapter all to itself. |
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5/18/07 3:34:41 PM#34
I have a couple of friends who played Horizons say that some people they knew had gotten billed more than once or billed after they had cancelled their accounts. This doesn't make sense to me. Who in their right mind would be like, "Oh well I got billed twice I don't care"? I think if this happened in a game like WoW, the boards would be in an uproar instantly.
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5/28/07 2:25:18 PM#35
The original design plans for Horizons was sweet, unfortuantely a lot of stuff did not make it in. I did enjoy playing the game until I maxed out on levels, then I stopped plaing. Too bad they could not pull it off.
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5/31/07 8:46:18 PM#36
I have to say all performance/engine issues aside, this game still has a spot in my heart, I truly believe the community there Pre-Tulga (i didn't hang around long enough for that to happen) was the best I ever have and ever will come across in a MMORPG. (I've played WoW a lot on and off, but have to blame WoW for almost singlehandly destroying MMORPG communities across many games).
A lot of the game concepts were innovative and pleasing to play I really liked the lack of an item drop based system and a game where crafters truly did form the heart of the game. I would dearly love to see Horizons resurrected with a better engine and competent management, that would be enough to draw me back, but sadly it looks like the ink is nearly dry on the writing on the wall (apologies for messing the metaphor up). |
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6/08/07 2:31:19 AM#37
I never played this game, but i remember keeping an eye on Horizons back before it was in beta. It looked like it was going to be something special but by the time it was released, it looked like it had become a very different game... that turned me away from it at the start. Though it doesn't affect me too closely, it is a bummer to hear that such a cool looking game got sunk like this.
I've always been curious about what happened to this game. Thanks for posting such an informative thread. And good luck to all those still involved. -sinnical |
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6/09/07 2:37:40 PM#38
Originally posted by HadesPvP Horizons fanbase was made of of the most abuse-tolerating people you can get. Distilled down over and over, as more regular people got fed up and left, until only the most hardcore fanatics who took the abuse and bugs as if it were a proof of their superior moral character were left. Or you had those that were happy just RPing in a graphical chatroom (The friends I met there were what kept me on). Also, never underestimate the power of playable dragons, it's a huge factor in most people staying on at all. The first game to actually do it right, and have playable dragons, will have an instant fanatic playerbase. |
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6/11/07 7:40:45 AM#39
Interesting read. I tried the game back when it launched. The game was really hyped up and had some good ideas. Those ideas just never got implemented.
The life and birth of an MMORPG. Thanks for the read. ;) |
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shakaama
 Novice Member
Joined: 12/23/06
http://allyourbase.planettribes.gamespy.com/video1_view.shtml |
6/25/07 1:04:36 AM#40
I think your timeline is a bit off. Out of all the games ive played and wanted to play, i actually WANTED to play this game. I followed the developement from the start. what's his face didn't leave a month after announcing they were starting the game. they were well into development, when the investors told him to tone it down because it seemed the project would be endless the way he envisioned it. when they revamped the vision, that's when i lost interest.
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