Vanguard: Saga of Heroes

nice this thread have too many posts .....thx for ur work

Originally posted by Abraxos

Originally posted by Supernerd
well,from what i read was from this interview i got this from it:

Microsoft got too demanding and impatient and was distracted with the X Box and after Sigil got away from them things got weird inside Sigil.
it was kind of like a real soap opera.cheating on your spouse and a power struggle for control of  things.people like me won't ever know what really happened but i still stick up for Brad.he trusted these people and gave them jobs and they went behind his back and i think eventually things got way out of hand.

A coup attempt! Do you guys know what that means?Everyone turned on the captain!how could the captain command the ship when they were all against him?

I think there are some people who are not getting their fair share of blame and you guys are being way too mean to Brad.

i read that there was a "coup" attempt.What really happened? we will never know but i think brad is getting too much blame.
The boss never really does anything ,that is how real life is.So i think it's not mostly his fault.

I think Brad is the goat,but it's the guy just under him who should get the biggest blame.

Micrsoft gave Brad 30+ million dollars to make a Triple A MMORPG. If they asked him to do a naked tap dance he needed to be asking what sort of shoes he should wear. They paid for the right to start asking questions and wondering why Sigil couldn't show anything of value to it's fans, to E3 and most importantly to MS, their investor. Who cares if they started focusing on the Xbox 360, they had given you 30 million dollars and you didn't do anything with it.

Most of the time when a Mutiny happens it's because the captain is doing something stupid like ramming into the same iceberg over and over. Read the developer post and his interview over again and tell me that Brad isn't a pig headed selfish wank who probably never listnened to his employees.

I will agree that Brad isn't the only one to blame but everyone else sunk with the ship while Brad stayed home. I know he has watched enough Star Trek to know that you always go down with the ship. He may have hid from his employees but the fans will sink him now.

Indeed.  Think of the quarterbacks in football, or presidents of countries.  Many of the things that happen are out of their hands, but they get the blame. And it is to be expected.  They are the leaders.  If your company tanks, it is your fault, and you deserve the blame.

As the token religious guy in any game i play, organization i write for, etc, I can say pretty safely, one of the things that is most important about the Christian faith that I myself profess, and Brad says he does, is accountability for one's actions.  Accountability and repentance.  Its obvious that Brad's decisions caused these people to lose their jobs.  The least he could do, out of the Christian charity he believes, is be man enough to face them, and maybe even apologize.

Originally posted by monoth

Originally posted by andmiller

Ya, just f'ing perfect.  You mean the company that has invested $30 mil in your crappy game actually wants you to set milestones and timelines?  You mean they wanted you to try and wrap something up that had been in development for years?  You mean they wanted you to stop running your company like a grade-school art project and run it like a business??

 

This guy is just priceless.  The only people who still support anything he says are people who have not worked in the real world.  Do you think my company would just allow me to work, doing whatever the h*ll I wanted, and then say, "oh that technology didn't work, we are going to try a new one?"  This whole thing is absurd.  The game sux.  This guy is retarded and is someone who should never have been in charge of a company as he has no idea how the real business world is run.

 

Microsoft, I applaud you.  Sometimes you got to "know when to hold em.......know when to walk away.......know when to run." 

Did you read the entire article??

Microsoft wanted him to make a AAA MMO to compete with WOW... Blizzard spent 80 million making WOW, Sigil was suppose to get the financing to take on WOW and halfway through it Microsoft pulled the rug from under there feet and decided to spend there time and money pushing out the Xbox 360 instead of Vanguard...     You guys keep saying 30 million like its a lot of money, its not in the gaming industry anymore...  Again Blizzard spent 80 million on WOW,...  I wonder what Vanguard would of been like if they spent 80 million on it...

 

And considering we know that nothing was really done until the very end, perhaps what Microsoft did could be described as "prescient."  They saw the writing on the wall, and started hedging their bets.

We need a thread dedicated to Jeff Butler. The guy is as much to blame, if not even more. Just because he isn't talking (which is damn smart granted) doesn't mean he can escape all our wrath!

Originally posted by Nikoz78

Originally posted by JDexter

This has got to be a joke, right?  Forgot the smileys and /sacasm tags.

If it's not a joke, then you are a scary person.

A person with balls would have been at the firings, standing up in front of the people who he was supposed to be leading.

I will admit that I was a bit emotional in writing this. It makes me sick how so many people can be so heartless.

So some don't think the game is fun and were disappointed. That gives people the sense that they have a right to say all the extreme and ugly things about a person they don't even know?

Just love how so many people in these forums think they are MMO 'experts' or something.

These forums are like a ghetto full of the most negative assholes ever assembled in one place.

Why is it so hard to believe that a huge corporation like Microsoft screwed him over? And they did! After all they did to him he still has the decency to try and speak well of them. Thats what I call professional.

I know of greed and I know the power money has over people. It's a religion of capital. It's all most people know or even consider.

I have always thought people like Raph Koster and Brad McQuaid are misunderstood and flawed artists. Laugh all you want. You say I'm "scary" because you are so 'shocked' that someone disagrees with something you believe to be a given fact.

Both these visionaries have had major failings. Koster with SWG and McQuaid with VG. Both failing because of huge corporate greed. Neither getting to fully realize their vision. Both projects destroyed due to the pursuit of more money faster.

Whats scary is the level of hate and ignorance in this thread.

Some people lost their jobs and that is terrible - almost as terrible as McQuaid losing his entire company and dream due to corporate greed. I feel sad for all at Sigil.

To McQuaid I would remind him of something Nietzsche wrote  - "what can not destroy you can only make you stronger!"

So you are whining about whining?   You talk about all the negativity then use profanity in your post.

Me, I guess I'm used to the decline in civility on the internet.  Though I do think the majorityo f people who post are articulate enough to avoid using profanity, and they do avoid it.

Originally posted by iceman00

So you are whining about whining?   You talk about all the negativity then use profanity in your post.

Me, I guess I'm used to the decline in civility on the internet.  Though I do think the majorityo f people who post are articulate enough to avoid using profanity, and they do avoid it.

How many of us dream to open a gaming studio to create our own dreams and see them come to life?  I cannot blame him for his attempt.  He can, on the other hand, be blamed for the poor management skills and his innability to seek help when it was needed.  Hopefully he will be more open to advise in the future. 

The event as a whole was unfortunate.  My sympathies go out to all that were affected and wish them all the best of luck getting back on track.

Originally posted by Nikoz78

Originally posted by JDexter

This has got to be a joke, right?  Forgot the smileys and /sacasm tags.

If it's not a joke, then you are a scary person.

A person with balls would have been at the firings, standing up in front of the people who he was supposed to be leading.

I will admit that I was a bit emotional in writing this. It makes me sick how so many people can be so heartless.

So some don't think the game is fun and were disappointed. That gives people the sense that they have a right to say all the extreme and ugly things about a person they don't even know?

Just love how so many people in these forums think they are MMO 'experts' or something.

These forums are like a ghetto full of the most negative assholes ever assembled in one place.

Why is it so hard to believe that a huge corporation like Microsoft screwed him over? And they did! After all they did to him he still has the decency to try and speak well of them. Thats what I call professional.

I know of greed and I know the power money has over people. It's a religion of capital. It's all most people know or even consider.

I have always thought people like Raph Koster and Brad McQuaid are misunderstood and flawed artists. Laugh all you want. You say I'm "scary" because you are so 'shocked' that someone disagrees with something you believe to be a given fact.

Both these visionaries have had major failings. Koster with SWG and McQuaid with VG. Both failing because of huge corporate greed. Neither getting to fully realize their vision. Both projects destroyed due to the pursuit of more money faster.

Whats scary is the level of hate and ignorance in this thread.

Some people lost their jobs and that is terrible - almost as terrible as McQuaid losing his entire company and dream due to corporate greed. I feel sad for all at Sigil.

To McQuaid I would remind him of something Nietzsche wrote  - "what can not destroy you can only make you stronger!"

Nikoz78, were you, by any chance, in the Vanguard beta while it was funded by Microsoft? Because I was, and I agree with you, if I understand you correctly.

What I experienced in Beta 1 and Beta 2 was beautiful. The interface was completely different (about a dozen different interchangeable interfaces designed by Tom King!), there were more innovative game mechanics (wounds, spellbooks, a wider range of body customisation, et cetera), the graphics were more to my liking (dark nights, non-overbright days, tastefully magical spell effects, subtler weapon effects, more hair-like and mediaeval hair meshes, et cetera), and the rate of development was blindingly fast and very efficient. Communication with the public comm