Any time someone requests a topic I will try to stem off with a new blog and archive them by what request I am covering. The first request was to blog about possible alternatives to experience points for leveling in future MMO's and how these alternatives may function.
While many games in the Role-Playing genre level based on experience points some companies have made attempts regardless of how large or small to change leveling as we know and understand it hopefully making it more "User Friendly" One of these games I have seen in action though have not gotten a chance to play myself is Crisis Core for the PsP a Final Fantasy VII Prequel if you will. In CC (as I will call it from here on out) players engage in combat and experience a slot machine style interface in the upper left hand corner. Throughout fighting the slots are constantly spinning. When a player reaches a certain number of Soldier Points the chance for what we used to know as a Limit Break now called a "Power Surge" takes place. If you roll all 7's or three sevens, your player gets to level up, otherwise you experience increases to your attack power hit points and the like. If you receive two numbers which are the same your materia has a chance to level up.
In my time watching this play out, I thought "WoW, this game could take ages to level..." seeing as how your chance to level seemed random, however when we took a look at Walkthroughs for CC it seemed as though players worked out a mathmatical equation so as they could track what they then called Experience.
In my opinion, one of the only successful ways I see future MMOs breaking from the confines of XP as we know them would be to rework leveling into more of a Rank Structure. Similar to schools or signing up for militia or army. Take for instance wanting to be a Warrior. You have a representative for people who wish you to fight for them you go through Initial Training and eventually get sworn in. You start as a low man on the totem pole receiving only basic or nub gear, skills, and stats. Based on your actions, successful full completions of quests and objectives etc you can impress your leaders with something like faction. At a certain point you receive a rank increase which then unlocks new skills, gear etc. The game still allows you to progress but it also gives you the ability to attain to much of the game content in your peon state as well. Allowing for larger combat sequences in where some people serve as fodder on the frontlines or more experienced troops sent in on flanks or as "the cavalry" Your ingame ability and dedication allows your level NOT a mathmatical number which can be tracked and estimated. Leveling could happen swiftly for people who gain the favor of their leaders and can even loose rank for insubordination and re-rank with other factions. If you remain loyal to people group 1....you have access to their special sciences, abilities magics etc. But you can/could also betray them and switch factions as a similar rank for someone else...loose those abilities and have a whole new slew of abilities with people group number 2.
A game functioning like this keeps not only the level mechanism fresh and new for players but also keeps the PvP fresh and new as you encounter other allies and enemies with different abilities. As content is included new people can come on the scene and challenge people and their loyalties. I believe changing to a more RL model of moving up in the work force or the military is a much more reliable method of advancing in level as we know it. Of course, it could be as flawed as the slot machine method and could possibly become tedious and/or annoying at times.
Yeah the first concept reminds me of a skill-based RPG whereas there is a random dice roll that determines how high the skill gain is. I'll try to go dig up a film on that CC never played it
Concept #2 I really like. Reminds me of Elder Scrolls Oblivion's Guild Houses. You gain rank the more you complete quests with them and earn new skills, exclusive items, etc. Not quite the samething
Yeah the slot machine method I am curious how did the players determine the mathematical property to predict the skill gains....
Wed Apr 09 2008 7:11PM Reporthonestly I have no idea. The game NEVER discusses XP...but if you look at the walkthroughs they give amounts of XP for boss kills and the like. It was odd. All we could think is that maybe the Japenese Version is different from the release in the US.
Wed Apr 09 2008 7:17PM ReportTaking away the EXP also takes away the player's control over their character's growth; having a mathematical system in place (one that's easy to interpret; what easier system than a cumulative numerical value?) give the player a better idea of progress and achievement.
Of course, this is all textbook talk, based on the fact that MMO's are geared towards the mass-market "casual gamer" who - while potentially being capable of memorizing a myriad of parameters and in-game mechanics - are generally not that skilled.
Your typical MMO user is one who responds to two things - progress and reward - both exploited by the concept of EXP.
A ranking system, in my opinion, wouldn't be a suitable alternative to the EXP system, simply because you take away a player's control over their character's growth. Players no longer have a easy way of knowing how much time they would have to invest in order to reach a certain milestone in their character's development. Making the game skill based is another story.
Raising the bar in terms of skill level doesn't usually drive players away; it's the lack of feedback that makes a player give up. Taking away a system that constantly records your character's growth is taking away feedback to how good/bad you're doing.
More feedback can easily be implemented: for example, the repeated use of a certain skill/item allows you to become more proficient in that skill/item, granting access to new skills or new abilities. Despite the current norm being a less complicated version of that anyway... (you take up a skill tree, learn a skill, when you're higher leveled you're technically "more proficient at that skill" since you've had it the entire time, therefore allowing the learning of harder skills in the same school).
Thu Apr 10 2008 12:32AM ReportIts always nice to have someone piss in ur cheerios ;) danka.
Thu Apr 10 2008 1:13AM ReportI dont think he pissed on your idea. I'm actually thinking the solution is simple- you can display ranks ingame as the players progress through their respective Schools.
For instance in Elder scrolls your "title" changes as you excel in the ranks of the Guild House you joined. This gives the player the feedback they need
Once you "beat" or master a school you get a Master Ranking and it feels even better then reaching Max Level because you impact the world and NPCs treat you differently.
Thu Apr 10 2008 1:55AM ReportAnother example is EVE Online. Pretty much same concept. You pick an Agent / Corporation. As you complete missions for that corporation you get higher and higher difficulty missions. Literally, the missions vary from Level 1 to Level 5. As you complete missions, you see your "standing" with that corporation increase and you can gauge your progress this way
This is EVE's way of leveraging Levels in a good way.
As you gain loyalty to that corporation you unlock special items and goods that cant be acquired any other way (I think well ev1 else might have to pay you for it).
I just purchased some items in the store tonight and thought bout this blog actually hah
Thu Apr 10 2008 2:06AM ReportEh? I thought my comment was constructive more than taking a piss...
You have plenty of merit in saying the EXP system is old and pointless, but you also fail to acknowledge it's a simple system that aims to please the most amount of people possible.
Basically, you're straying from the "safe zone" in terms of game design. That, plus the fact that you have little basis in claiming people are tired of the EXP system.
Maybe your description of the ranking concept is just too vague for me... it doesn't look good on paper, and hardly anything works if it already looks bad on paper.
What works/have been known to work, like I've already said, is progress/reward: which translates into instantaneous milestones. MMO players expect to know the impact of their actions ASAP, it's one of the motivations behind playing MMO's.
You'll have to explain further; how does this ranking system cope with failure? Does the player know what went wrong if they don't acquire their desired rank? What is required of a player who wishes to progress their characters in rank?
Actually, I don't know how this ranking system would work at all; would you mind explaining in detail or at least give an elaborate example?
Thu Apr 10 2008 1:58PM ReportMMORPG.com writes:
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