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Teala's Wickedly Cool MMORPG.com Blog For The Masses

Just my thoughts on MMO's, roleplaying, game companies, and the people that play these games.

Author: Teala

Am I the only player left in the world...

Posted by Teala Wednesday December 23 2009 at 10:49AM
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Am I the only player left in the world that wishes to see an MMORPG that is built around a virtual world, filled with wonder and adventure and has combat like that which we see in a game like Mount and Blade where player skill and knowledge of the weapons will determine the outcome of a fight instead of some random number generator?

Seriously...I am getting seriously bored with today's button mashing hotkeyed games that are full of flash and auto targeting. Where is the excitement and the fury of a battle where you face your opponent in combat with just your shield and sword, where your characters life is one sword swipe away from death? OMG how I would love an MMORPG with Mount and Blades combat system.

Unless you've played Mount and Blade you'll no doubt not understand where I am coming from, but once you've tasted the style of combat one finds in that game you'll find yourself wishing and longing that you could play your Blood Elf or your Tauren in an MMORPG with that kind of combat.

Plus where is the dungeon crawls? OMG not the lame arse dungeons we see in current MMORPG's. I'm talking dungeon crawls that require you to be on your toes at all times because of tricks and traps and all manner of beasties that hide in dark. gloomy places and jump out at you making you flinch because it happened so fast. I'm not talking the strategically placed MOBS that always spawn in the same place in a dungeon like you see in WoW or a lot of these other MMO's. I'm talking about ruins that have catacombs beneath them with narrow passages and chambers filled with all manner of horror and death to those that may wonder into them looking for a long lost wondrous treasure. One dungeon that I loved in one of these recently released games came from the game Vanguard. I know...I know...just hear me out.

See this place sets the mood first. As you approach the entrance to this dungeon you notice the area around it goes all gloomy and you know that something sinister is afoot and it makes you sit up and be prepared. The sky goes dark, a mist covers the ground and the trees have cobwebs and gnarled branches and you hear strange noises...OMG it can freak you out.  Then to top it off there is a sign at the entrance that warns of the death that awaits those foolish enough to enter.   This sent shivers up my spine because when I played I heard tales of this place from otehr players telling me to avoid the heartache and pain that I would find in that place.  They told me to literally forget it and move on.   To wait until I had a lot more experince before attempting it.    They were serious...and I soon learned why.

Once inside this dungeon of terror, you encounter spiders and such and  the way the lighting is done a small spider can cast a huge shadow on the wall and you think to yourself OMG how big is that spider we're about to encounter? Then some spiders drop from cobwebs that cover the roof of the spider tunnels and some spiders pop out from around dark corners right in your face - making loud hissing sounds as they gnash at you with their nasty pincers or try to stick you with their stinger. OMG that dungeon had it going on and I will never forget the time I spent exploring that spider hole from hell. That is what a dungeon should do and it should be a challenge to make it in and out alive...and that one truly was a fun, memorable romp.

OMG I am so sick of having to grind for gear! Please of please...just let me find some decent armor, a good sword and maybe a bow that I can use to slay my enemies that will last the lifetime of my character! I do not need some flaming sword of death or burning skull staff of doom! N0... just a simple scimitar and shield is all I ask for. To many games are so gear centric that that is what the games all about is gear! So much so that when you do get that good gear you discover that your character looks and behaves just like the next Joe/Jill gamer # 420, 678....doesn't that get old? God I hate it.

I so wish for the day when I can customize and create a unique character that looks totally different and plays the way I like and wish to play in a virtual world and not some never changing world of pre-placed - never changing mobs whose AI is so predictable that you can set up a macro to kill them because they always behave the same way. I know game designers can do better - so do it!

Details - details - details.   WoW got this right when it comes to details.   Watch your character one time.   They fricking breath!  Yes - just watch.   They are animated to show your character breathing.    When in cold areas and they exhale you see their steaming breath~!   That kind of detail you'll not see in other games.    This I would like to see and more.    When a game designer takes the time to polish the details it makes the game that much enjoyable to play...is it really to much to ask other game designers to pay attention to the small details as they do with the big ones?   I think not.    So come on...when you make game - make it seem alive and not dead and stagnate!  OK!  Blizzard did a great job here in a lot of ways...I just wish it wasn't so theme parky.   Plus  I wish we players had more impact on the world itself and - like over hunting an area causes certain mobs to migrate or not hunting causes things to occur...like certain MOB's become so abundant that they start randomly attacking towns and villages and can even over run them!   That is what we need.  

OMG I am telling you...the time has come for a game that pushes the limits of technology and gives us a hybrid virtual world/theme park/sandbox/fps/rpg game. Seriously...now more than ever we need a game like like this. We need designers to go back to the basics and look at this genre and shake it up the way WoW did. We need innovative game mechanics that put the action and game play truly into the hands of the gamer to allow them more control than ever before on how their character, looks, behaves, and acts in a game and how they can impact that world through their actions and interaction with it.

A game like this can be made - come on designers - use your creative brilliance and really give us a cool arse MMORPG the way one should be made!  Surely I am not the last gamer who loves MMORPG's that wishes for such a game?
 

Player_420 writes:

No I think anyone with a better appreciation for MMORPG's who played them before WoW hit the market, are just drooling for what you described. But who wants to go so far outside the box? When you do people dont want to buy your game becuase "Its not as good as WoW" or "Theres no endgame raid content"....

Hardest thing in a sandbox indie mmo (like the one you detailed in your post) is to get the themeparkers playing it without comparing it to WoW and bitching every 2 seconds.

So therefore will any indie MMO that attempts this be successful? Like I have written about in blogs before...

when you think about it why arent we comparing every MMO to pre-trammel UO?

-Housing

-Boats (islands exploration)

-No instancing (non instanced dungeons either)

-Plenty of loot, while keeping loot "balance"

-Full loot PvP, which made you watch your back, and feel that anything could happen at anytime.

Wed Dec 23 2009 11:08AM Report
MadnessRealm writes:

Consider yourself lucky, there are more than 1 person who wishes for the same thing. Only thing though is that they found their new game like Mortal Online or DarkFall.

Wed Dec 23 2009 11:14AM Report
Teala writes:

Player 420 - it is simple, designers have lost touch with this genre and are just delivering action arcade games for the masses.   It's like walking into the local game parlor and plopping a quarter in a game machine type gaming.    I feel that gone are the days when we could log into a virtual world and just go adventuring and looking to see what lies over the next hill.   

Plus...the time has come for a new style of combat instd of this same old same old hotkey auto targeting BS that is archiac and old.   The tech and programming exist for something better - and a small game company named TaleWorlds has proven that FPS type combat can be done online.   Their innovative combat system is so new and exciting that I find it so hard to play a game like WoW because I feel I like the computer is playing my character and not me,   I do not feel that way when playing Mount and Blade/Warband.    OMG it is so exciting to shoot an enemy with a bow from horseback or to couch lance one or to face one in toe to toe combat with just a sword a sword and shield.   That is how combat in thse games should be and hopefully some day a game designer will give us that type of control in an MMORPG.

Games need more adventure.   More customization.   Bigger and better virtual worlds.   Gear should not be what the game is all about, but should compliment it.     When this happens...we'll finally have broken the old stale mold that is currently used to design games for this genre.

Wed Dec 23 2009 11:19AM Report
AshGUTZ writes:

Plus...the time has come for a new style of combat instd of this same old same old hotkey auto targeting BS that is archiac and old.

 

Chronicles of Spellborne. Dungeons and Dragons. Age of Conan. Look at where all of THOSE games got.

Wed Dec 23 2009 11:51AM Report
Astropuyo writes:

M&B is quite fun.

 

Right now thought I'd suggest games like Chronicles and DDO for that "Cool ass dungeon" feel. I've been playing DDO for a long time for that factor. (After burning out on LOTRO).

As for any mmo ever matching the epicness of M&B, never.

Wed Dec 23 2009 12:00PM Report
wootin writes:

Teala, the combat you describe is actually how games USED to be, before there was auto-targeting technology. Remember the early Elder Scroll games where you moved your sword by moving the mouse?

Before I got out of the tutorial zone in Daggerfall, I'd had an honest-to-god mad hack'n slash Errol Flynn-style battle with two skeletons at once, ducking around candelabras, hopping over tables and chairs, jabbing and slashing with my rusty sword and trying like h-e-doublehockeysticks not to get hit again by one of them, as the first hit took 1/3 of my health.

That was a seriously fun moment in my gaming life, and I wish to god the industry had picked up that model, instead of auto-targeting and auto-attack.

Wed Dec 23 2009 3:49PM Report
Player_420 writes:

Wootin, FE did a pretty damn good job at that.

Wed Dec 23 2009 3:50PM Report
rafaelrehn writes:

mount and blade was the most overrated piece of garbage in the last decade

Wed Dec 23 2009 3:55PM Report
osh652 writes:

i have been dreaming of a game like this for YEARS! i fully agree with you on this... and latly i have been playing mount and blade (eagle and the radiant cross) and its great. but there is a game that i find is very good, EVE online... yes i know... you have to pay for it and its very difficult to understand... but its an entire universe that you can explore and (i believe) conquer.. there isn't any swords or shields or PEOPLE... just ships and pictures... and seeing as its in the future, there is auto-targeting... there is also the gear thing... the bigger ships beat the smaller ships, hands down... but it does mirror reality in some aspects... the market, for example, the prices on things really do go up and down... there could be an economic crises (like were [the US] are in now) if no more things were being sold or to many things were being sold... or some one made a company (or whatever they use for guilds and such) and they stopped people from selling things in the market by promesing rishes or newer better ships... but i do agree with you that the game designers can do better and if a few companies band together and can create a great game that fits to our wishes... and (in order to make SOME KIND of profit) charged a small fee... id suggest just a download fee, a one time thing, not like WoW which charges monthly (and thus makes it so i can't play it  >.<  ), becuase they need profit in order to pay there people to create newer better gameplay... but suggestions for a new game.. in space? midieval? just after guns were created? what? (i can't believe iv typed this much on this one little thing :P) and another game (that glitches for me) is planetside... it takes place far in the future and not anywhere near earth... there are 3 sides... each one has its own specialties, stealth, lasers, ect. but you can conquer planets for your side using all kinds of vehicles and birds (helecopters and planes) and there is also and underground area which you need to conquer before you can take the planet itself... you can take a computer controled ship to a planet of your choosing and drop from space down to the ground in about any where of your choosing on the planet... *sigh* im getting tired of typing so just gunna post and go back to my trial (for the dozenth time) of WoW... good night, merry christmas, il most likly for get all about this tomarrow... :P

Wed Dec 23 2009 5:22PM Report
Kenaoshi writes:

well, so we gonna wait for mount&blade warband and wait another 20years for they to make their mmo =)

Wed Dec 23 2009 6:25PM Report
kabuto202 writes:

You're not. And developers understand that. Here's the problem: It's technically near impossible to have a system that allows such things to be determined real time and by skill and still have goals that people want to strive for so that they continue playing. Face it, grindy hit-one-key gameplay is what makes MMOs, well... MMOs. If it wasn't for that, no one would bother playing for more than a day, either that or the developers would be over worked and just quit.

My point is, that I can speak for most developers out there, cause well... I am one. The problem is doing it correctly, and there were many games that tried and failed, and are making minimal profit. Like Darkfall, AoC, and many more.

 

In the end, Mundane and Familiar = Profit. New and Strange = Bankruptcy.

 

Wed Dec 23 2009 7:58PM Report
seferz writes:

I understand what you are talking about. To be honest, Darkfall is a great game, only reason I stopped is because it was so powerful, my computer couldn't handle it, need to buy a new, special one that focuses only on gaming power.

lets face it tho, auto-targeting is getting to the point where it is unbearable... When playing the game 2090 (or whatever its called) I have to go to sleep after about 30 minutes of that nightmarish auto-targgeting stuff.... Oh look, I can just put my guy in one place, turn on auto-target and then watch as my guy does all the work... Fun....

Darkfall is a great game, I am hoping to get a new computer soon so I can try Fallen Earth, which is even harder on my computer than Dark fall is.

What I wouldn't mind seeing, is a .hack//sign online game that is like darkfall or fallen earth, with a huge range of customizable features and such indepth detail... Of course, the more detail and customization... And more animation and flashyness, = the more expensive computer you will need to play the game. Lets face it, new, flashy games require alot more of a computer than the older ones.

Wed Dec 23 2009 8:53PM Report
daltanious writes:

Agree nearly with all you said. Especially love idea of random mobs (and, why not, bosses) attacking in dungeons. And also big yes, wow has great animations with details, like breathing in cold areas.

Thu Dec 24 2009 3:56AM Report
TJKazmark writes:

Teala, you are certainly not the only one who feels this way. I myself would drop every game I'm playing to check out the one you descibed. I believe a game like this is possible; where there's a will there's a way.

Whether a game along these lines would be successful or not is, I feel, a secondary factor. I love games, specifically MMOs in the fantasy genre. If one could be designed and developed with these details and many others in mind, a polished game of this nature I feel would attract enough dedicated or curious followers to where the money would take care of itself.

Personally, I would take the career time to execute this venture. I may not be the most qualified when in happens, but I certainly wouldn't be lacking in enthusiasm. XD

Here's to the future!

Thu Dec 24 2009 9:16AM Report
drago_pl writes:

Eve, Darkfall and most likely Mortal Online (haven't played it yet). Too bad there are dozens of angry wowers (WoW clones players) who just bash games that dare to be different.

Wurm, A tale in The Desert and Ryzom (most underrated game of decade imho) is also around, but lack of PvP turned me off of them.

We are really waiting for some real games, where Massivie in genre name don't mean number off people spread on 5 man instances all over the servers.

Thu Dec 24 2009 10:21AM Report
Vexe writes:

I agree 100%. I need all that detail and it makes me sad to see all this lost in the current money crunch that is the MMO genre. I am happy to see gmaes like darkfall, eve, and mortal on line coming out of development and even coming out on top.

oh, and read this please, Teala --->

MORTAL ONLINE IS GREAT.

I'm no fan boy. And the game certainly has flaws; but it is incredible and does most of the things that I wanted from an MMO. Skill-based combat with fun character prgression, great crafting, all of which adds to a very immersive world that you can get happily lost in.

The Caves are incredible too. Almsot pitch black as you get deeper into them, you can see old dwarven ruins inside vast expanses and glowing hives of some large bugs. There's even an underground forest and city in one or two.

The animations are very realistic and It's great and I love it.

That's just my opinion, though. Look for this one when it comes out.

At least read the reviews. :P

Thu Dec 24 2009 12:33PM Report
Vexe writes:

you know, when it comes out.

Thu Dec 24 2009 12:46PM Report
Neiko writes:

 I'm looking at Global Agenda. For customization, graphics, weapon system, and player skill. Although DDO had some of those things, since you had weapons and armor, but they weren't tooo different. With active blocking and swinging, and real dungeon crawling, but the downside is that it was all scripted. So, some things can scare your pants off the first time. But after that, it's pretty much you know it's there.

Thu Dec 24 2009 6:57PM Report
Gnomig writes:

This post made me log in after almost 2 yrs. to rate a bump.

You scored 10 of 10.

 

Fri Dec 25 2009 10:51AM Report
Teala writes:

Thank you Gnoming....that means a lot to me.   ^_^

Fri Dec 25 2009 11:12AM Report
Plageron writes:

Not a bad posting.

I think most people will agree that the problems you mentioned is mostly do the engines the designers have been using as of late.

Almost every single one is the type that utilizes predifined graphics for the characters and enemies...

There was a few games that did utilize a system that you hint....where the skills actualy made the actual movements and powers and things come back faster.  But mostly those where games that didnt make it too well becasue the designers dropped the ball onthe story and some of the major graphic designs and power balances.

It was interesting you mentioned Worlds of Warcraft and their small breathing...i hate to say this...but they stole that concept and alot of other things from many other games.

The really sad part is that you would think other game designers might do the same thing....

The game City of Heroes already had the breathing and hair movement and alot of other animations on a character already along with the ability to make your self look like what ever you want....no cookie cutter looks there unless you truly cant be creative.

You are right though the ambiance with the dungeons and the entire trap thing are thrown out the window lately.

But i think i know why....lately there has been a huge increase in young children playing the games we all play....and there has been a huge increase in mentally challenged individuals as well. I think thats one reason that many things have been dumbed down so much.

I still see people complaining becasue they get lost in some underground area in city of heroes....they have a map yet cant seam to navigate the 3d area...or the lighting and special effects or the illusionary light effects make them not able to find there way at all.

I would suggest that game for alot of interesting features and things to see....another good game which in my opinion has captured the aspects of pvp alot better then most games is a game i recently started playing called Jade Dynasty.  i would have to say its PVP is alot more balanced then many games...but then again...thats just my opinion.

Anywise i want to rate your article a 10 out of 10 as well.....

it was good well thought out and very thought provoking....

Sat Dec 26 2009 12:37PM Report
rello writes:

LIKE OMG RIGHT?

Sat Dec 26 2009 6:42PM Report
stully3037 writes:

 This will be my first post to so AGREE with you.  I dont want to look like everyone else or have the same skillset, that is what will distinguish players from each other.  You hit the nail on the head, combat system instead of mouse bashing?  Heresy.  Cant wait to see it happen and it will eventually.  We could all be in our graves by then, but it will happen

Sun Dec 27 2009 10:20AM Report
velimirius writes:

WoW and games after are only single player online games,where you can finish like 80% content solo...

Since WoW there's no more interaction with world like it was back in UO.

So i agree with you completely.

Sun Dec 27 2009 11:40AM Report
Latella writes:

Worst thing is, this would be perfectly doable, and in some instances even easier to program and build than the current arcade gameplay we are offered.
Sadly, why innovate and try new things when you can copy paste one of the other 100000 games out there with no effort and start cashing some $ ?

Your article was fun to read because all those things you exposed, are the same, exact  things that were going thru my mind as i played Mount and Blade myself...

Sun Dec 27 2009 1:46PM Report
reanor writes:

 Teala, I suggest you to buy Demon Souls for Playstation 3. You will love the challenge of the game. But you'll never have MMORPG or even MMO with a similar level of challenge. That MMO won't live long. I won't explain why. You just don't understand the concept of different age and game pace player groups.

Sun Dec 27 2009 8:38PM Report
Dajag writes:

I have played all the big name MMOs - Each one normally has one or two great features - but in the end they are all grinds for gear and have pin-holed cr^py class systems (lame) - Customization is the first thing thats lacking today - Bring a character creator like Champions to fantasy - A world Like Vangaurd (with out the bugs) - A skill based system for spells, weapons , armor and crafting - A level based system for Races - A point based system for divine - add a NwN style diplomacy ( that ment something) - Forward and lateral character development - Make gold worth something by getting rid of the world wide market ( Hence the Gold Sellers) - Small local markets so players have to adventure - worry less about graphics and more about frame rate, looks, FEEL and appeal.

People always bring up games that try somthing new and fail - they failed because they did everything else wrong not because what they did different.

Vangaurd - Great Dungons - they failed because they had lousy frame rates, horrible character model customization - no high end content  - Faction grinds

AoC - great look/ ok combat - Failed because lousy crafting, no character customization / no elves or dwarfs or fuzzy races for the kids.

Warhammer - Great story/ race humor / good small group PvP- Failed because broken endgame - Large game PvP became stale after lvl 12 - every castle/keep looked the same, felt the same had the same two doors - what a horrid crafting system - unbalanced dungons

There is nothing wrong with PvP, Raid zones, instances, player run shops, skill systems - a crafting system that is as complex and diverse as the gear system or combat system.

They have all been done extremely well before

The problem is developers never seem to look at everything at once; they either focus to much on one aspect of their game, or they try and recreate the wheel (and fail).

WoW succeeded because they did not do anything new - they just put it all togather in a nice working (high Frame rate) package.

I do not like WoW ( I give them their props though) - Its for personal reasons I do not like WoW

WoW is too - cartoony, dumbed down class system, kiddy quests and kiddy predictable AI, Gear centric - Open world market - no feel to their dungons .

I think there is a huge niche market for an MMO developer that goes back too basics - starting with PnP RPGs - and looks at all the things that these games did right and puts it all togather in a surreal non-cartoony world with  lots of color/ customization that looks good, but is not pixel/graphic heavy - plays well (good frame rate)

And most of all - Let the players choose their play style (No Classes) (No being forced to raid , gear or faction grind)

It would be easy , but would take some BIG KAHUNA'S

Mon Dec 28 2009 1:35AM Report
Ludipe writes:

I´ve been looking for a game like this after i left GW, by the way i am playing DDO until they release something like this, i really enjoy exploring dungeons, avoiding traps and feeling like a real heroe, not just like the one who controls him.

Mon Dec 28 2009 3:48AM Report
soponyai writes:

The problem with developers is that they all want to beat WoW or come close to it? Why not ignore that? Make something new.

Sure, it will have less people, but the ones who love it will be fans. Not every game has to be market leading, as long as it makes profit it should be good enough.

Ah well, one can dream.

Mon Dec 28 2009 4:36AM Report
Dajag writes:

soponyai is right - at first there will be the normal 'its not WoW like' crowd that bash it without ever trying it (it will be too hard for them at first) - But  the scattered masses of true open world MMORPGers will come - and they are a loyal crowd.

Their out there - they just need a home - They are in EQ, EQII, NWN 1&2, Dragons Age, some are still playing UO, DarkFall, DAoC, SWG, Reading Tolken for the 1000's time to get a fix or any other classic true adventure, some are even still  enduring Vangaurds bugs, lag, and lack of expansions, heck some are even hiding in WoW.

YOU BUILD IT and THEY WILL COME! O_O

I have to use EVE as an example - not my type of game - but they made a game that has a loyal crowd and a good niche - they listen to their players and ignore the 'its not WoW ' crowd.

Mon Dec 28 2009 8:35AM Report
Kurai3 writes:

So, what your saying more or less is that you want a world that is truly dynamic, and combat that is less about random numbers and more about skill. I will certainly agree with you that M&B pulls this off damn well, and it makes sense.

A Static world works just fine for a Single Player game, because it's far better at communicating a plotline, you play through it once or twice, have some fun, and move on.

A Dynamic world on the other hand would work so much better for MMO's because it would be a major shift in the way content was produced and used (It would get a hell of a lot more use for one.) Let's look at M&B Again, it's a huge ever changing world where you can do just about whatever you want. Is there a whole lot of Variety? Not really. Is it still interesting? Hell yes. I mean there are maybe 30 different quests that can be given to you, and there's no real story, but because the world itself keeps changing, it will spontaneously GIVE  you a story. Wandering around, helping a few small villages prosper when a Rival faction attacks and Takes over? Congratulations, you've just randomly run into motivation to join a war. Why not have a system for running and starting your own Villages, Cities, Castles, Even nations and pit a Number of NPC Factions against you all while the solo adventurers come to you for work, or just sit and watch in the backround.

Mon Dec 28 2009 9:14AM Report
Teala writes:

It is so refreshing to see so many people on the same boat as me on this.   You know I am just as tired of orcs and elves, but you know what, I think a medieval fantasy based game that doesn't go to far overboard would be do-able if it was done right - for once and had the things that some of us are looking for in a game.

As one of you said, "build it and they will come".   I think this would so be true.

Mon Dec 28 2009 10:14AM Report
Papajahat writes:

the problem is there maybe only about 10,000 ppl want this compared to 10 million mmo subs.

furthermore it is impossible to satisfy your hunger coz it will never be what you want. it doesn't matter how great it is, it still can't beat your first love, daoc,uo, swg or your mount and blade.

if you want those stuff you should look for single console game, not in mmorpg.

in 10 years i've played countless mmo. basically 2 mmo at a time. each mmo atleast 6 mth. i love all mmo i play. its not the game. it's the community.

i dun hate ppl i fight with and i dun love ppl i fight for. it just fun play with or against them.

i dun dream of what kind of next mmo to play. i just dream a game that fit my fantasy. once i login and watch my character for half and hour doing nothing, that the sign to move on.

in my opinion, dev should create a game base on 6-8 mth playing time. when ppl play your game more than  2 years, something is just wrong.

Mon Dec 28 2009 10:19PM Report
b0mb3r writes:

I came from games like Ultima 7, Ultima 8, Might And Magic, The Elders Scrolls (Single Players) and Ultima Online (MMORPG). I agree with you 100%, i always expected in a MMORPG a world like the singleplayer games that i played, i love Ultima 8 besides the horrible grafic compared to today games Ultima 8 is better than the others in all aspects (My Opinion), second come Oblivion IV, like u said when u get into a dungeon and u can feel the danger getting close, that is freaking awesome, and the game don't have autoaim, like Ultima didn't had as well, so your player skills matters on this point.

Being a Ultima series fan, made me play Ultima Online for about 5 years, was my first MMORPG but not the first Online Game, i played WarCraft 2 and Diablo 2 for more than 3 years. Anyway, after Ultima Online i tried many diferent games like, WoW, Line Age 2, GuildWars, MU Online but after 6 months i got boring, cuz like u said, this are gear based games, lets take the most popular like an example: WoW.

WoW is a great game it entertained me for 6 months, and belive for whom is playing RPG since Castle of the Winds (Another Awesome game), 6 months is a lot of time compared for all the others games that didn't got me for more than 1 month. But WoW still a gear based game, after u do countless dungeons and fight for the itens and pray for the rolls to get you epic item, so GREAT i have my epic gear, then the game become pointless. What is the point for PvP!?! Raid? U already won the game, like a single player. If someone with crap gear manage to kill you, its fine he won Nothing, and u still with all your shiny itens, there is no competition, the game is a themepark is a cooperative multiplayer game (LoL).

I played UO for 5 years, and i loved it, and still on my opinion the best game ever, pre-trammel of couse, my last days on UO was on a free-shard. So after UO the search for a great MMORPG begins, many WoW style appeared but none did what UO did. So back to singleplayer: Baldur's Gate, NWN, The Elders Scroll...

One game catch my atention when i already gave up of searching: Darkfall.

Darkfall is the only game that i'm playing for more than 6 months (Since Release) after UO. Darkfall is not the perfect game it lacks on RPG aspects, but Darkfall is far better than many games on the market.

Teala considering the PVP, Darkfall is the game that you are looking for, but if you expect a dungeon like you describe, unfortunately Darkfall don't deliver it. It have a pretyy world, a good grafic, not awesome, but still good, a great Politc game, what you do really afect the world (I already saw Battles (200+x200+) mergin for simple 3kills, i already saw alliances ending after 1 player fight, its so many featearues that i can't describe in a single post. Conclusion: The game that you describe doesn't exist, but we are getting closer, and i think that you should experience Darkfall or Mortal Online (I didn't played MO yet, but i heard great things about it from DFO players).

Tue Dec 29 2009 7:52AM Report
Melquisedec writes:

I totally agree with Teala's, devs should focus on building virtual worlds, real virtual worlds. Build in such a way that NPC exist to bring support to the world run by players and not the player to support a world run by NPC.

A game where we can almost fuse with our character's feeling that when we hold a sword is because we grabbed it, and that when our character hit a targets it is because we actually reached it.

A game where players decisions are directly reflected is what we need. A game that we can actually shape by interacting with it, and not that the game shape us.

Devs should focus on bringing some real game content while giving the player freedom to shape the virtual world. I love M&B and Darkfall is an idea of what we want.

WoW has come to be a curse to the genre. Most mmorpg company became pathetic after WoW because all of them just keep comparing with WoW.

Teala this thread only describe my dream for a very good mmorpg. I sincerely congratulate you for such a post.

Tue Dec 29 2009 8:08AM Report
Comnitus writes:

To summarize all the comments:

YAAAAAAAY TEALA YAAAAAAY WE WUB JOO!

Tue Dec 29 2009 9:38PM Report
slorndag writes:

/Signed

Like seriously, I agree with every single paragraph.

Tue Dec 29 2009 10:20PM Report
Quale writes:

Incredibly "incorrect" and incredibly charming post. BTW, you're absolutely right on most accounts and why complicate matters right.

Wed Dec 30 2009 3:51AM Report
sfc1971 writes:

Have you actually played M&B for a while? It gets old pretty damn fast. It is a one trick pony. Could you play it for months?

You want dungeons that suprise you... how? Random generator? Even that only lasts so long and you will get complaints that player X dungeon was far harder then player Y's and therefor Y didn't deserve his reward.

You spin a nice yarn, and it sounds tempting but that does not make it a good game design. Go back to the drawing board and sketch out how such a game would be build, what its rule sets would be. How you would handle all the communication for a 24+ raid plus AI with real time free targetting combat.

Why don't we see the game you want? Because it would be impossible to produce. I have been trying to design a very similar game (although I am a fan of turn-based game (even if played without pausing ala X-Com: Apocalypse/Dragon Age Origins)) and you run into countless problems. 

 

 

Wed Dec 30 2009 6:00AM Report
Votan writes:

Couple of reasons why this is not likely to happen:

  1.  These games now cost what a major motion picture cost to make.
  2.  With the above most MMO's are made by corporations who are really only concerned about the bottom line.  It is almost impossible for a indie studio to get  50-100million dolllars to make a game.  The ones that they can make will not and can not have what you descibed do to the cost involved.
  3.  Corporations are not run by "gamers" they are run by suit and tie bottom line people and the investor money comes in from being like WOW not different than it.  Getting 100 million dollars or even 50 million if you want to do it on the cheap will come from having something that has proven itself not by something that has never been done.
  4.   The development community is inbred and have not step outside the box for a decade or more.   If you really look at all the games since EQ they are all at the core the exact same game with new paint and a few new ways of doing the same thing.  I am talking about core game play. 

I would love to play the game you have described maybe one day it will happen but I will tell you it will not be in the next 5 years. 

Wed Dec 30 2009 10:55AM Report
Kyleran writes:

Good post Teela, count me as one of the faithful waiting for a virutal world like you've described. 

 

Fri Jan 01 2010 4:44PM Report
whisperwynd writes:

I also wish to see this, where you can 'feel' like you're a part of the world, not just 'acting' in a high school play with your avatar. :P

I certainly hope, for us players, that someone out there will come to realize this and make it happen. Otherwise, I feel mmo's will be a genre I will leave behind.

 

Sun Jan 03 2010 2:23AM Report
dhayes68 writes:

Whatever the reasons are it would seem the mmo-as-world concept is dormant if not dead. Will it revive? Yes, I think so. Someone with independence, vision and tons of cash is bound to get it right, but given those hurdles, it could be awhile.

I guess with the rise in popularity and the restraints on time most normal people have, people like us are going to be ignored as financially unworthy of attention.

Sun Jan 10 2010 11:03PM Report
Evasia writes:

Well i would go even further with complex gameworld then you discribe, but im affraid we are in minority.

But for me it must be a challenge a real challenge and real danger with alot of risk, and im affraid there is no market for those games.

Look at this new themepark called swtor millions following it, so new game as you discribe will only work if its realy easy and casual and hyped like crazy with big name or IP others wise dommed before started.

Btw take a look at dawntide its very intresting sandbox game with alot of potential if your not realy into topnotch grafhics and don't mind bit of old skool.

Wed Mar 31 2010 12:40PM Report
Evasia writes:

To Wootin they went for auto attack so from 8 to 80 could play.

Mass demanded easy gameplay and slowly outnumbered hardcore who always hated all this ez-mode crap.

Even Darkfall have to suffer for this so called hardcore ingame all went for magic becouse it had area of effect spells so you not realy need to aim.

While bow was way more fun but harder to master.

So its even hardcore community who ruin there own genre.

Wed Mar 31 2010 12:48PM Report
Vasagralem writes:

What the original poster is looking for is the perfect mmo, and of course it hasnt been made in the "real" world yet, but it has been made in Manga, there are several mangas that have an mmo system similar to what she is looking for, the ones that i know of and that i recommend to anyone who is a fan of mmorpgs are: Hack//sign (dont know the sequels, havent read them), Yureka aka Lost Saga, and Ressentment. The later especially, because its narrated from the perspective of a "real" person in the "real" world who occasionally, and later on more frequently, goes into gaming, the others are narrated mostly from the perspective of a character inside the game itself.

Tue Apr 06 2010 7:41PM Report

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