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Rollo talks games. (And Pie)

Just another gamer pretending to know what he's talking about.

Author: Rollotamasi

EVE. I REALLY wanted to love you.

Posted by Rollotamasi Saturday January 5 2008 at 4:13PM
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I admit it.  I have always considered myself a pretty hardcore gamer but I wasn't hardcore enough to hang with EVE.  I LOVED the setting.  I was getting to the point where I was a bit tired of fantasy and wanted to give something different a try.  The EVE world is terrific.  When I was playing EVE I reallyfelt like I was in space.  The would just seemed massive. (Exactly what I would hope from a space MMO).  But in the end.  I just couldn't hang.  I wanted to, I really did but I simply couldn't.  For me, the game had 2 glaring issues that made me step out of the captains seat.

My issues aren't the cut throat nature of the PvP.  Honestly, I am a pretty PvE focused player yet the constant risk of being attacked even in safe space didn't bother me in the least bit.  I held true to the golden rule of EVE, Don't fly anything you can't afford to loose.  I learned quickly that if I was going to be going to low sec on a regular basis then Implants were going to cause me more frustration then they were worth.  The things that bother most new EVE players really didn't bother me.  But still, I just couldn't get over 2 things.

Issue number one.  The skill system of EVE is INCREDIBLY deep.  The storyline is deep.  The crafting is deep.  The races and ships are deep.  The one thing however that I found NOT deep was the game play.  In all honesty It's not really so much the game play as it is the combat and movement.  Don't get me wrong.  Like most Western gamers I am a WASD type of guy.  A game being point and click doesn't TOTALLY but it does put a damper on a game for me.  What I don't understand is this.  Eve has some great things in it that make use of motion.  Distance plays a important role.  Transversal velocity play a role.  But the system of movement really makes those items feel arbitrary. 

Let me get something right out in the open because I know what a lot of people are going to say.  "They aren't small fighters, they are massive space ships!".  I understand that.  I don't expect a space battleship to handle like a F302 (Props to anyone that gets the reference).  However I need something a bit more then double clicking a area in space and starting to fly there.  I just never felt like I was really in controll of my ship and that really kills the imerision in the game. I am the captain of a starship, I want to feel like I am actually in control of it. Transversal velocity plays a major role in hitting your target but I never felt like I could take offensive manuevers .

Second is the combat.  Clicking on a enemy ship to target it there really isn't much to combat other then clicking on your "tank" (Assuming you are using a active tank) and clicking on your weapons and waiting for the other ship to explode.  I am not a button masher.  I really loved FFXI combat where classes only had a few skills to use.  It doesn't bother me when I only have a few skills.  But the bottom line for me is that I have to have something to do during combat or else why am I even there?  The ship does 95 percent of the fighting.  I felt more like a spectator then a captain.

Second is the skill system.  The skills your character has has a HUGE impact on the game. There is a metric crap ton of skills in EVE. I loved the idea that I could tweak my character towards drones, or missles or whatever.  It made me feel like my character was trully what I made them.  But the longer I played the more I began to understand 1 very important things. No matter how long I played and how many skills I aquired I would NEVER be able to match up with the vets  because there is no skill cap and  the only way to aquire skills is time.

Don't get me wrong.  I understand that tactics and skills as a gamer are a HUGE advantage.  However character skills in EVE is equally important if not more.  Because the only way to aquire skills in ever is through progressing through a set amount of time, it became apparent to me that I was pretty much always going to be a "Low man on the totem pole".  Lets face it, EVE is a great game but there isn't a HUGE influx of new players.  This meant that for the most part my character was always going to be behind the majority of the player base.  I just couldn't deal with that.  If I loose to another player because they have superior tactics and strategy then I have no issue with that.  If I loose to another player because they have a better understanding of the game I also have no issue with that.  However, when if I loose to another player simply because they have been playing the game longer then I have then I have a issue with that.  I have a big issue with that. 

I played EVE for about 6 months.  I really wanted to hang in there.  I miss my megathron.  I miss my drones.   If I had started playing eve from the start then there is a good chance I would still be playing right now. I probably could have gotten over what I consider to be dull combat.  However, I know there is no way I will ever catch up and that there will always be players out there that can beat me in a fight just because they have been playing the game longer then I have.  The list of things that I loved about eve is HUGE.  But in the end, that fact that I could really  "catch up" killed it for me in the end.

ppetty writes:

you can catch up to the vets

after a while, you get to a point where there rent really anymore skills in your area of specialization, and you start broadening the areas of gameplay you can get into.  true, with combat oriented characters, this takes a while because a large chunk of the skills are for combat, but if you go to ineve.net and look at some of the top players in skillpoints, you will see that after maxing the gunnery skills for their weapons, they moved on to max the other weapon types as well.  they also train spaceship command for the other races.  so if you think about it, only a quarter of their gunnery/spaceship command skills will be effective really for whatever ship they are using.

thats why i think mining is a great way to start playing eve.  it takes a couple months to max out mining skills, during which you can make a few hundred million ISK, then you start on combat gameplay, and you have a headstart in ISK.  also mining is safer than combat and if you stick to high sec, you arent very likely to lose any ships, and along the way, you can pay attention to the starter corp chat, and learn lots of stuff just by seeing other newbs ask questions and get answers.  questions you might never have asked for months and months.

yes, mining is boring, but its a learning experience, and later in the game, you can always drop back to it

Sat Jan 05 2008 4:28PM Report
Rollotamasi writes:

I agree with what you are saying for the most part but there are a lot of skills out side of direct combat ones that still effect combat.  For instance, Navigation skills, Grid / CPU skills.  "Tanking" skills.  They all have a impact of combat.  While I agree that with time I could have also maxed those skills, I guess I am to impatient to spend 2 years just learning skills so that I can then play the game on a competitive lvl with the other players. 

Sat Jan 05 2008 4:32PM Report
g8torskull writes:

I have played eve since beta. I have 2 characters one with 57 mil sps and one with 55 mil sps. I can tell you that when it comes to pvp skill points does not matter. A person with 5 mil sp can defeat me in battle with the right setup.

My main character is a PVE and is quite crappy trained but is a mission whore nontheless. My alt is pure pvp. What I have figured out is even though my alt is purely pvp my mission whore main with crappy skills in combat kicks more ass at pvp than my pvp character does.

It does not matter how many skill points you have as long as you have somewhat of an idea of what you are doing in combat. pvp is more of a group activity in eve. So being a solo pvper you will get beat 9 times out of 10. I think you should give it another shot and spend some time reading the forums http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp to learn how to set up ships and get the max out of your skill points

Sat Jan 05 2008 6:36PM Report
Meltdown writes:

I have similar feelings about EVE. I keep wanting to go back and start it up again, but I know that every month that I didn't play hurt me in the long run. Although my biggest pet peeve is that there was no real difference in me playing and me not playing. I can make money zombie mining or whatever its called and get my skills up and NOT EVEN PLAY THE GAME! Why waste my time playing a game I'm paying for... really.

Sat Jan 05 2008 6:42PM Report
Rollotamasi writes:

I appericate the advice and I have spent a good amount of time on the forums.  I am a old school mech warrior fan so things like studying setups is great fun for me.  I spent HOURS looking over and tweaking setups.  My setups were not my problem.  I just didn't have enough skills points.  Everyone had a better tank, better gunnery skills, better drone skills.  I really do hear what you are saying.  Knowledge is more important that skill points.  Honestly, that just isn't the case.  If the person you are fighting has ass maxed tanking, grid, energy, drone and gunnery skills, chances are he is going to beat you unless he is a complete idiot.

Sat Jan 05 2008 6:43PM Report
DKKOberon writes:

You hit the nail on the head. Those are the very reasons I have quit playing EVE. And I had three 30million+  skillpoint characters and I STILL felt like a noob fighting SuperDuperMan in every ship battle. When I started I'd get into a fight, lose ship and get podded. Thirty Million plus skillpoints later...I'd get into a fight, lose ship, and get podded.  Questions of "Why Play" because "Later dudes". And CCP lost 4 paying accounts.  And this was after 3+ years of playing so don't EVEN accuse me of not understanding the game.

Sat Jan 05 2008 7:08PM Report
Rollotamasi writes:

I really think that they should have put a SP limit in the game when it came out.  It would have added a bit more depth.  Players would have had to make choices in what they wanted to specalize in instead of being able to do everything given enough time.  Want to be able to mount a really great tank?  No problem, but the rest of your skills are going to be a bit lacking.  Want to be great with gunnery? No problem, but your not going to have neough SP's to be able to mount a uber tank.  There would have actually been some choice and planning involved instead of just needing time.

Sat Jan 05 2008 7:22PM Report
Thaliost writes:

I can relate with your first issue; but no so much with the second.

 

Anyways what helped me play Eve for 1 year, was also the sheer complexity of the universe. Being a part of a corporation with goals and missions. The long hours spent together with your friends, the organization, the plots, the commerce, the drama, etc. All this helps make up for whatever issues one might have.

Sat Jan 05 2008 8:48PM Report
Rollotamasi writes:

I have to admit, Not having a good corp really decreased my enjoyment of the game.  I joined 3 or 4 corps.  All of them talked a good game but none delivered and I was kind of left high and dry.  At that point my employment history looked so crappy that any hope of getting a decent corp was pretty much lost.

Sat Jan 05 2008 9:04PM Report
ycluk writes:

This is comment is longer than I though, but I share my exp here.

I played EvE for a year and finally quitted. EvE's features complexity are awesome, and it's unique, so not many games can match that.

However, the skills system doesn't have any cap, and it rises overtime, so the earliest starters gets the most advantages because they have the most time to learn all the skills, and later comers can never match up with veterans skills.

There should be a skill cap in the game to limit the ability for 1 character, and it makes sense to put skill cap because no one should be able to "know everything".

For the pvp, you need to be in a group. The guns and missiles are big gun for big targets, big guns won't hit small targets easily, and small guns don't have the fire power to kill big targets ( except technology level 2 ships with tech 2 weapons might be possible ), so you need to be in a group ( or a fleet ) to have well-round all kinds of ships to go against all kinds of targets. Also, getting any voice-chat applications helps a lot for communication.

PvP skills and ship setup can kill PvE setup easily, but if both are PvP setup, veterans beats rookie, almost, without exception which is not fun for later comers.

The movement and combat is click to move/action style, so it's an RPG game rather than action game even though it has lots of action. The target lock and attack are totally automatic, and click to fire rather than players have to aim and shoot. It depends one's preference if they want that kind of spaceship action. I like to aim and shoot like FPS, so I tried Jumpgate and Vendetta online which both require players to aim and shoot while flying their ship.

Since EvE is RPG, it's almost all about playing around with math, and pretty much no chance to " cut a tree with a knife ", and that makes the game less dynamic and interesting. For example, in EvE, if character skills are close to same, and ships are the same class, the one with better weapon and more shield / armor is like to beat the one with less firepower and defense. Almost more people usually means more firepower and that means victory. But in JG, players need to learn how to aim and fire, so more doesn't equal to the winner, and that makes the game more interesting.

When the players have to be "actively" involved during all the gameplay time, it makes the game more interesting ( of course, courier mission is always boring during the travel time for all games). And this is what EvE doesn't provide to players.

Jumpgate doesn't have skills if I remember correctly, it only has rank ( almost same as character level ), and I don't like that. The rank limits what MODs players can use. In EvE, players need to learn different skills to use different MODs, in JG, you only need to rank. So in EvE, you need to spend XXX amount of time before you can use XXX MODs, but in JG, as long as you are rank X, you can get whatever MODs require that rank. However, this way in JG makes the game "seemingly" lack of content.

Although EvE's universe is somewhat instanciated, EvE's universe is THE biggest in all MMO games. It has probably a thousand solar systems in the game, and each solar system probably several stations, planets, and moons which makes each solar system have HUGE area. That provide players with lots of play ground, and no game I have ever played can match EvE with that.

Finally, I tried Vendetta onlinie, and it seems like a simplier version of JG, so I didn't continue after trial, but you are welcome to give it a shot.

Sat Jan 05 2008 10:21PM Report
mutantmagnet writes: "It does not matter how many skill points you have as long as you have somewhat of an idea of what you are doing in combat. pvp is more of a group activity in eve. So being a solo pvper you will get beat 9 times out of 10. I think you should give it another shot and spend some time reading the forums http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp to learn how to set up ships and get the max out of your skill points" You're missing the point here g8torskull. Ofcourse eve is a group game but that doesn't null the fact low skill in equal numbers can't beat high skill. The epic story of goonswarm proves the point that eventually you need to upgrade to bigger and better ships because you can't frigate spam (lower skill requirements when maxed out for all possible fittings) against corps that got their act together and matched their numbers while still using the more cost prohibitive cruisers, battleships, etc. (increasingly higher skill requirements when all useable skills for fittings of those bigger ships are maxed out) Sun Jan 06 2008 1:56AM Report
visgrail writes:

Eve -- My Experience

Whoa, this tutorial is freaking complex! After playing with it for a couple hours ... Hey this isn't so hard after all.

A few days into Eve ---Wow, this game is awesome! I feel like I'm really in space! I gotta tell all my friends about it.

Joined a Corp ---These guys seem really cool; with a good corp behind me I should really start kickin butt.

A few days in the Corp --What do you mean, you podded my ship as a training exercise for me?! Who needs enemies when I got you guys? Jeez

A few days further into the game --Hmm, I need to raise my missile skill these missions are starting to kick my butt. 15 days to train!?! Real time!! THAT"S FREAKIN INSANE...

Good bye, Eve

Sun Jan 06 2008 2:07AM Report
Inf666 writes:

I played eve for a few years as well but stopped because of pos warfare.

 

I would like to comment on the "dull" combat system. WASD-people are hoping for fps like action where one player can win against his opponents with aiming and movement skill. Eve is different. Skill means: teamplay, strategy, experience. 1vs1s are fairly simply and work in the way you discribed (skill point dependend). The thing is: 1vs1s never happen. Its always group vs group. Fly with a specialised 10 player gang around using teamplay with the necessary mods and I assure you that you will get overwhelmed very fast. In group fights skill points do not matter, even ship size does not matter. Eves PvP world is team based but unluckily a lot of players only want to solo, even in pvp.

Sun Jan 06 2008 5:37AM Report
Rin_Pride writes: Yup, Inf666 is right. I started playing EVE few days ago, tho I continued with character created in 2006 on trial, he got only around 1 mil exp. First of all - I got into a nice corp. It's hard to find one, but possible. Not too lagre, but skillful and friendly guys. At this point I know, that it's meaningless to try and attack someone solo. Heck, I'm not a 1337-kid, wanting to be "uber pwnz0r", killing everything that moves screaming "ima 0wnd ya, soopid noob! ima mor uber th@n u, noooooooob!!!1!1!!!1" =) What I want is to play a game with a deep and interesting gameplay and many possibilities. And that I got in EVE. Even in PvP, tackler - is one of main roles, no matter how funny it sounds, when you fly frigate besides giant battleships =) And the skills, required to tackle, are *easily* obtained in a few days! In a month+ you will be quite nice tackler, tho yes, perfection is unreachable =) There is no problem with skills and vets, there is problem with wanting to be "uber pwnz0r" ;) Seconds. Controls. Yes, you are a ship caprain. And you really feel like *capatain*. Not gunner, not pilot, not electronic specialist. You command the ship, you just tell what to do, where to fly and whom to attack. And thats quite fine. Would EVE have WSAD-like controls, most ppl, who play it now, would quit. Because combat is too complex there to use WSAD. So, EVE is quite nice as it is. You can play it with much comfort, you just need to accept challenge. What for do we need games if there is no challenge? Can't compete with vets? Just find a way. The main advantage in EVE is that the game really gives you means to find a way. Compared to WoW with it's gear-oriented PvP, where epic sets and stuff rules to the point, where you can't do a damn thing *no matter what* on some level... EVE is just fine. Cause you can always find a way =) Sun Jan 06 2008 6:08AM Report
vajuras writes:

At least this author gave EVE Online a chance for a few months. Props for that. Many bloggers wont even try it. Now thats not so bad- but then when they turn around and try to blog/criticize EVE online it makes those nubs extremely annoying too me.

Sun Jan 06 2008 8:45AM Report
vajuras writes:

"I really think that they should have put a SP limit in the game when it came out. It would have added a bit more depth. Players would have had to make choices in what they wanted to specalize in instead of being able to do everything given enough time. Want to be able to mount a really great tank? No problem, but the rest of your skills are going to be a bit lacking. Want to be great with gunnery? No problem, but your not going to have neough SP's to be able to mount a uber tank. There would have actually been some choice and planning involved instead of just needing time."

 

EVE Online doesnt need an SP LImit. Look at Guild Wars veterans can also learn any skill given enough time. EVE Online problem is that they have a "skill tree" system and it takes "time" to learn those skills.

Although I must confess I'm not too sure what the problems people are having. I enjoyed crafting,trading, agent missions, and the occsasional PVP. I never sat around and got envious of players that played longer. I minded my own business and enjoyed myself

Sun Jan 06 2008 8:48AM Report
oramio writes:

Well, I am playing the game for two active months, and here are my observations:

- Skills are very important, but a quick note: I have seen a battlecruiser and battleship blown up by a frigate (T1, simple type). (BC=100 mil credits, BS=130-140 mil credits, frigate 450K credits). I do not know a MMORPG that you can achieve this

-If you'll PvP alone, and you're heading for PvP specialists on losec space, you have to be careful and smart. Try to scan and find ships that you can hunt with your current setup, be sure that he's alone, and go. With correct decisions, you can gank a much more high skilled player if he's alone

-It is not that hard to get a HAS or HAC to go for fight, and they are not extremely expensive. You can kill a lot with those ships. You just need to gank an opponent suitable for your ship. If you are heading for the same ship, having better skills are always good, otherwise pray that your opponent doesn't have countermeasures for your setup (he's a missile boat and you have sensor dampeners and missiles, he has to run away. You have webber and he doesn't, he's doomed. You have a NOS and he cannot counter, he's doomed. etc etc. There are so many things to say on that... Skillpoint system is not the decisive point in this game for PvP, act sneakily, think evil :)

Sun Jan 06 2008 9:02AM Report
Rollotamasi writes:

"You command the ship, you just tell what to do, where to fly and whom to attack. And thats quite fine. Would EVE have WSAD-like controls, most ppl, who play it now, would quit"

Maybe this is part of my problem.  I don't see EVE combat as complex in the least bit.  In all honesty it has in my eyes the least complex combat of any MMO I have played.  You pick a target out of a list, lock it and click your weapons.  They will continue to fire until they run out of ammo.  They then reload on their own and you click them again.

 

Sun Jan 06 2008 5:55PM Report
Rin_Pride writes: "In all honesty it has in my eyes the least complex combat of any MMO I have played."
Guess that's the problem =) The complexity arises in PvP and fleet battles. And in most cases your ship doesn't even got weapons, so what you wrote above means you missed most of the game) The combat isn't about only "pick a target out of a list, lock it and click your weapons". In the market you could see tons of different modules, and all of them are used in combat. Starting with jammers, dampeners, energy vampires etc. Latest addition - heat system, where you can overload your equipment. Locking system also got a meaning - it allows jamming. And if controls were WSAD, the game in terms "noobs vs. vets" would be even more unbalanced. Player then could win using his own skill + advantage in EXP. Many ships got 8 not-too-small guns onboard. Now if all these gun where to aim manually with no counter-measures, it would be unstoppable. Now imagine. You got around 4-5 different systems, each requires capacitor while activated. Plus you got 8 weapon slots with 2 types of diffirent weapons and 1 type of energy vampires. Many systems and weapons have different optimal range. So, you need to keep the enemy ship at the same distance (the more accurate the distance is - the more damage you make and more accurate), also you need to keep in mind you capacitor, you shield-boosters, your heat status... And this is just for starters. If you can't see the complexity of EVE combat and saying "it should've had WSAD-controls" than you missed all the game in it's reaaly not a MMO for you.
Mon Jan 07 2008 2:19AM Report
HeupoMaHTuK writes:

I totally agree, Rolotamasi.

Left EVE after the 1st month.

There is one (the worst) thing you didn`t mention. EVE skills system completely kills the desire of logging into game. Why would I log in if that looong skill will train itself in 15 days time anyway and there is no way I can speed up the process? Yes, I can earn some cash, but why would I if the ship I could spend em on will be available in those goddamn 15 days anyway? So... I don`t need to log in and play at all.

The game itself was designed to be played in semi-afk mode, imho.

Booooring.

Mon Jan 07 2008 3:47AM Report
Sevenswords writes:

I also played eve I enjoyed it didnt mind so much that it played  semi afk mode, but I did mind about training the length of time the skills where taking to train.

 

I thought it was a bit silly paying for a game only to train my skills which would take so many year or one month for one skill? No thank you if I played from the begining then yeah would of been a different story.

Mon Jan 07 2008 4:47AM Report
LeJohn writes:

I had played EVE off and on since beta so I always find it funny when ppl post "Sckill points realy dont matter in PVP"  I have destroyed HACs attacking my barge with nothing more than my drones because my shield, drones and secondary skills are maxxed. 

I even chased off a new player flying a Mega with nothing more than my Bestower, well my hybrid/specalization skills, mech, eng, shield, tact skills all maxed made my 1 small named railgun hit harder than his, not to mention my invun shield absorbed 95% of his dmg.  His shild was gone I was nipping at his armor when he ran.  Point being, had he had the time in to have the skills necessary to actually dmg me, he would have been a vet.

Which is funny, ppl always post that you can catch up because you can only train to lvl 5 but the reality is thats just 1 training.  Take gunnery, sure you can train to lvl5 in gunnery but to be competive you have to train not just in gunnery but in the type of gun, then the specilizations skills, then the larger versions.  It would be easy to spend 3 months training nothing but your race gunnery skills (alone).  Now if you want T2 skills, add a few more months.

Also, one of the main point I used to love was that you trained in real time, this is great untile you actually relize that you train in real time because that way CCP is insureing that you have to keep paying to keep training.  One you have that awakening that the only reasion to have the training as is, is to insure subs.... Well it the same as when you wake up and realize that you have 3-4 accounts because they have the game set up so you have to if you want to compete or pay for your PVP.

What ended it for me after playing for 5 years was not so much that I was logging in only to set training, nor was it that being podded no loner mattered as it set me back only a few min, no what ended it was that I relized that i was playing EVE windowed while playing other games and was paying for the sub. See I was playing free to play games such as SONW and would watch EVE and only activate the window when something actually needed my attention. 

The day I not only took the gold star as top player but was the commander and had the most flag defends playing BF2 while mining enough mins to build a few BCs was the day I realized I had played EVE for too long.

EVE was a great game when it started but I have not seen anything that would fix the problems the OP or others like I have with the game that would bring me back.  Walking on stations and the latest patch, well as my fathe in law used to say "You can spray a turd with gold paint but that does not change it from being anything more than a turd with a new paint job"

Mon Jan 07 2008 12:53PM Report
Rollotamasi writes:

The complexity arises in PvP and fleet battles. And in most cases your ship doesn't even got weapons, so what you wrote above means you missed most of the game) The combat isn't about only "pick a target out of a list, lock it and click your weapons". In the market you could see tons of different modules, and all of them are used in combat. Starting with jammers, dampeners, energy vampires etc. Latest addition - heat system, where you can overload your equipment. Locking system also got a meaning - it allows jamming. And if controls were WSAD, the game in terms "noobs vs. vets" would be even more unbalanced. Player then could win using his own skill + advantage in EXP. Many ships got 8 not-too-small guns onboard. Now if all these gun where to aim manually with no counter-measures, it would be unstoppable. Now imagine. You got around 4-5 different systems, each requires capacitor while activated. Plus you got 8 weapon slots with 2 types of diffirent weapons and 1 type of energy vampires. Many systems and weapons have different optimal range. So, you need to keep the enemy ship at the same distance (the more accurate the distance is - the more damage you make and more accurate), also you need to keep in mind you capacitor, you shield-boosters, your heat status... And this is just for starters. If you can't see the complexity of EVE combat and saying "it should've had WSAD-controls" than you missed all the game in it's reaaly not a MMO for you.

 

I am sorry but I have to respectfully disagree with you.  I could see the combat being complex if your are in command of the battle, or maybe even a wing in a fleet battle, but for the individual player I just can not see the complexity.  A couple of examples

Your a tackler - Target what someone tells you, Activate your modules and select orbit at 500 meters.  Thats its.  No more interaction required.

Your in a sniper mega in a fleet battle.  Target whoever is called primary and activate your weapons.  Thats it.  Wait till it goes boom and then select the next primary.

Your in a damp boat.  Target who someone tells you, activate your damps and  wait till the target blows up.

I am sorry.  This isn't complex.  Its no different then the age old "Root and nuke" concept.  What I am talking about is a system that maybe requires a bit more personal interaction and strategy.  Example.  Anyone who has ever played mechwarrior know about heat.  That would be a great concept for a game like eve.  You have to manually fire your weapons (Not target, just fire) but each time you fire you gain heat.  Gain to much heat and systems start failing.  Maybe your shields start losing resists or something like that. 

The dual run permatanking myrm is a great example.  You turn every mod on and thats it.  When one target is down you move on the the next.   Once again, this is not complex.

 

Mon Jan 07 2008 2:34PM Report
nortonweb writes:

Orbit at 500m and your get smart bombed.

I think that EvE is an outstanding game but it does seem that the meat of the game only comes out after about 6 months of constant well directed training (ie not wasting training times on bad skills) also you starting stats needs to aid in fast learning of the skills you want to go into early and you need to get some training implants ASAP.

Once you hit the 6 month mark your at the more interesting lvl 4 missions and you have the skills to have a better fitting.

A 6 months in tackler doesn't just have their scram and webber they have the cap for other options too. The 6 months pilot has Battle Ships but with the really skills to keep them (I can perma tank a 1500DPS in my 7 month mission Alt which pretty much is anything a lvl 4 mission can throw).

But all of that take 6 months of guided training and mission running and small scale small PVP.

Yes some of the people above say that they played a year plus but was that a year plus of guided useful training or did you just train all the quick short learning skills which in a 1v1 you will never use?

I liked the comment of vajuras above:

"I never sat around and got envious of players that played longer. I minded my own business and enjoyed myself"

If you want to compete with the player base then EvE is not for you dude its a single server with a player base of 300,000 players at one time there are 30,000 players on the same server playing... name another game that has that..  WoW.. nope that has a max of much much less on a server.  If you want a player base you can compete with you will need a game with far far fewer people on the server!

Mon Jan 07 2008 7:00PM Report
wardog250 writes:

I'm am sorry.  This game was only designed for a small number of people.  This game will never been as massive as any other MMOG out there for many reasons.  One being that is a massive sink hole in a person's actual life.  When you play a typical MMOG you can max out your character in a month, then gear it out after you join a good guild later. 

With EvE, you are investing your life in a game that ages at the same rate as you do.  It's a very slow game that seems like it is on pause if you aren't getting ganked by pirates at a jump gate.  Some people may not have time to grind out a character at their own pace.  Than all you have to do is play EvE and flip the Sand Clock and watch the paint dry on the walls.  It's fun for a small percentage of people, but not for this guy.  I don't feel like investing $15 a month so I can have a game show me how much I've aged.

Sat Jan 19 2008 7:31PM Report
Leoheart writes:

If you read all that above. props to you. i can dumb it down for ya. this half says it's about how long you play. that half says time doesin't matter it's about what kind of corp your in. also the combat system lacks.

 

----Personal note----

Eve gets boring your spending most your time in travel or skills. to go into pvp expect paying for a year while updating your research daily and then get off and do other things. so basicly you have to pay 180$ and wait a year to play the game. ohh yeah and update your research when it's done. i love the idea i am big on space mmo's but don't expect to be flying a battlecruiser in a year. damn and i wanted my X305 right then :/

Fri Nov 21 2008 12:43PM Report

MMORPG.com writes:
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